Problem with Co-op cash minder account

posh_scouse

Hi

I have a problem with my cash minder account (currently BR so it was the only one open to me with online banking).

I've been out of the country a lot recently so have quite a few international transactions. Which is fine.

I with drew some cash last week and, it seems, the co-op don't apply the charge at the same time as the cash withdrawl happens.

It was 6th July I withdrew 100 EUR and it actually debited the account on the 10th with an additional 2 EUR charge. I have no problems with the charge in principle as I know thats normal.

The issue is that I am now over drawn by 1.80 which I'm about to transfer money in to cover it. Had the charge been notionally debited for the charge at the time of the cash withdrawl, then the later transactions would not have all processed. They were debit card transactions so authorisation was given at the time of the transaction.

Effectively, the bank authorised debit card payments because the funds were there but because they didnt *charge* the 2.00 EUR fee at the same time as the cash withdrawl, they have allowed it go overdrawn. I say they with some accuracy as with the exchange rate varying etc you don't exactly know what the actual balance is that is going to be deducted. I knew the account was close to empty (I keep a running total in a spreadsheet) and I get paid tonight so I wasnt worried as such. I assumed that the 2.00 was accounted for at the time of the withdrawal .

My issue is that the co-op have a three strikes and you are out policy and that despite me being careful with the account, I appear to have a strike against me already.

Is there anything I can do to appeal it?

pcombo

posh_scouse wrote: »

Hi

I have a problem with my cash minder account (currently BR so it was the only one open to me with online banking).

I've been out of the country a lot recently so have quite a few international transactions. Which is fine.

I with drew some cash last week and, it seems, the co-op don't apply the charge at the same time as the cash withdrawl happens.

It was 6th July I withdrew 100 EUR and it actually debited the account on the 10th with an additional 2 EUR charge. I have no problems with the charge in principle as I know thats normal.

The issue is that I am now over drawn by 1.80 which I'm about to transfer money in to cover it. Had the charge been notionally debited for the charge at the time of the cash withdrawl, then the later transactions would not have all processed. They were debit card transactions so authorisation was given at the time of the transaction.

Effectively, the bank authorised debit card payments because the funds were there but because they didnt *charge* the 2.00 EUR fee at the same time as the cash withdrawl, they have allowed it go overdrawn. I say they with some accuracy as with the exchange rate varying etc you don't exactly know what the actual balance is that is going to be deducted. I knew the account was close to empty (I keep a running total in a spreadsheet) and I get paid tonight so I wasnt worried as such. I assumed that the 2.00 was accounted for at the time of the withdrawal .

My issue is that the co-op have a three strikes and you are out policy and that despite me being careful with the account, I appear to have a strike against me already.

Is there anything I can do to appeal it?

No, its not up to the bank to manage your account for you.

You should read all the information and you should manage your funds better to avoid this.

posh_scouse

Well since I keep a running total on a spreadsheet - INCLUDING the 2.00 EUR that was entered at the time of the withdrawal I can't see what else I can do since I don't have the power of foresight to know exactly the exchange rate being applied to the transactions when they clear the Co-op system.

I do the calculation based on the most recent exchange rate on items cleared the statement.

In this case the exchange fluctuation was £1.83 more than I had calculated so when the 2.00 came off it put me overdrawn by £1.21

Had the co-op taken the 2.00 off the available funds at the time of the withdrawal (which is surely when it is due) then at least one of the more recent debit transactions would not have been authorised.

pcombo

but you knew there was a charge and you didn't have the fee available in the account. So supposenly it was taken at the time of withdrawal it would have declined since you didn't have 2 euro fee.

Not sure what your debt card transactions have to do with this. there seperate.

posh_scouse

I did have the fee available. I'll use round numbers to illustrate what happened.

Last week I withdrew the cash, EUR100 say - at the time there was £200 left in the account AFTER the withdrawal. So plenty for the £102 to be debited.

Over the last few days, I have spent £198.40 in authorised transactions - i.e. online authorisation received when debit card is used.

Last night, the co-op deducted the £2.00 fee - taking me to £0.60 overdrawn.

had the £2.00 been deducted at the time of the cash withdrawal, last week, then the £10.00 I spent night before last would not have been authorised as there would only have been £9.40 in the account rather than the £11.40 that was there which allowed the £10.00 to be authorised.

Because of fluctuating exchange rates, its impossible to know whether the £100 withdrawal will come through at £81.00 or £82.00, as an example.

I use the last known exchange rate when updating the spreadsheet then add on 10p to be safe unless its a big transaction in which case I add on £1.00.

They are rounded off figures but in essence show the issue.

posh_scouse

I know its my responsibility - I get that.

But is it not beyond the whit of man to think it reasonable to assume that the 2.00 fee for withdrawing cash is taken off the available balance at the time of the withdrawal and not made available for further transactions for up to a week before its finally deducted.

I know this now, and will account for it in future but it will still count as one of the three strikes and your out

pcombo

dont co-op give you a grace period like lloyds do. to pay it back.

Rafter

p_s

Hopefully the three strikes rule is intelligent enough not to give you a black mark for such a small amount due to a fee. If it does you could probably complain!

As for a way forward. If you have the funds elsewhere I don't see why you are running your cashminder account so close to zero rather than leaving yourself with say a £50 buffer for 'just in case' direct debits or fees that you might have missed on your spreadsheet.

You can only earn about £1.30 interest after tax a year on £50 which seems a small price to pay for peace of mind that your account will always have a small buffer just in case.

Good luck

R.

posh_scouse

There are no DDs on the account.

This account is used purely for income from a single source (my mother - paying me back money she owes me) and I spend what goes in.

All other expenditure is on a pre pay credit card loaded by my other half.

All household DDs go from his account and I onlyhave one mobile phone bill which I pay from the preloaded card

But yes, im going to have to have more of a buffer.

I think im just irritated

datostar

Have they applied an unauthorised overdraft charge? If so, how much if you don't mind me asking? If they have done so, all the more reason for keeping a buffer amount in the account because that's how they hit people for ever mounting charges by constantly putting the account overdrawn. Despite the good reputation of the Co-op Bank and it's ethical stance etc. etc. they're no different from the others when it comes to applying charges!

posh_scouse

datostar wrote: »

Have they applied an unauthorised overdraft charge? If so, how much if you don't mind me asking? If they have done so, all the more reason for keeping a buffer amount in the account because that's how they hit people for ever mounting charges by constantly putting the account overdrawn. Despite the good reputation of the Co-op Bank and it's ethical stance etc. etc. they're no different from the others when it comes to applying charges!

I spoke to them on the phone this lunch time and they said there would be no charge. I'll believe that when I see it!

I got the name of the person I spoke to and noted the time I made the call, so if they do put on an additional charge, I'll be kicking up a stink.

I'd rather use Barclays to be honest (and they were my biggest creditor) but they won't give internet banking until discharge so I'm stuck with co-op until then