parking charge from euro car parks

paul1263

Hi i dont know if anyone can help me with this ,but today i went to pcworld for a refund took about 5 minutes came out and this chap was putting a parking charge notice on my car ,i parked in a disabled bay ,near to the door there was lots of car spaces disabled ones too ( i suffer with sever sciatica after an accident at work and recovering from a bad chest infection too which meant i could not walk far) they want £60 from me by end of month , i can't afford this and feels its unfair i would not normally park in a disabled bay ,just not feeling 100% , how legal are these people the chap was not in any kind of uniform .

Stephen_Leak

Firstly, the legal stuff.

Only councils, the police, train operators and Transport for London can impose legally enforceable fines or penalties. A private parking company (PPC) or an individual can't. Even PPCs call their tickets “Parking Charge Notices”, not “Penalty Charge Notices”. In law, they’re called “speculative invoices”.

Any warning signs are usually so badly positioned and worded, that they won’t have created a fair and legally binding deemed contract between the car park owner and a driver entering the car park in the first place. See The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997 and Excel Parking Services vs. Cutts, Stockport, 2011.

All the car park owner (CPO) can claim from a driver in damages for any breach of contract is what they’ve lost as a result. If this is a free car park or they paid, this is £0.00. Demanding more has been judged to be unreasonable and therefore an unfair contract penalty under the terms of The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997, which is not legally enforceable. See Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co. Ltd. vs. New Garage & Motor Co. Ltd., House of Lords, 1914 and countless cases since.

There are also now two recent court cases, VCS Parking Control vs. Ronald Ibbotson, S!!!!horpe, 2012 and VCS Parking Control vs. HM Revenue & Customs, Upper Tax Tribunal, 2012. In both cases, the judges found that only the car park owner can take drivers to court. The Upper Tax Tribunal is a court of record, equivalent to the High Court, and therefore its judgement sets a legal precedent.

The Blue Badge scheme doesn’t apply to private car parks. Anyone, who’s disabled under the terms of The Equality Act 2010 can use a disabled parking bay. If they’re also Blue Badge holders, they don't need to display it. The Equality Act doesn't say that able-bodied drivers can't also use disabled parking bays. OK, they shouldn't, but they can. It's a nice idea not to take the last one, though. This probably contravenes the terms & conditions for the car park. But, the terms & conditions for the car park usually state that you shouldn't park in a disabled bay without displaying a badge. This, in itself, contravenes The Equality Act.

What should I do now?

We don’t condone not paying or overstaying in a pay car park. If you do owe the CPO anything, then you ought to write to them, offering this in “full and final settlement”.

In any event, you ought to advise the CPO that they are "jointly and severally liable" for the actions of their agents, the PPC, and that any further actions by them would be regarded as harassment under the terms of The Protection from Harassment Act 1997. That ought to make the CPO call off the PPC and, hopefully, realise the potential cost of doing business with them.

Don’t appeal to the PPC. They always reject them. What’s in it for them to let anyone off? Actually, there is something in it for them: information. They need to know the identity of the driver of the vehicle involved at the time, because that’s who the alleged contract was with. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to make do with chasing the registered keeper.

With windscreen notices, an appeal letter will tell them your name and address, and maybe who was driving at the time. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to buy the details of registered keeper from the DVLA. With postal notices, they’ve done this already. But they still need to know the identity of the driver.

They sometimes say that they have the right to ask for this information. This doesn’t mean that you have to tell them.

However, even if you’ve written and told them who the driver was, it doesn’t make their actions any less unlawful. It just means that instead of harassing the registered keeper, they can now harass the driver.

What will they do to me?

The PPC, then a debt collector and then a solicitor will send you a series of letters. The debt collector and solicitor are usually also the PPC, but using different headed paper. These letters will threaten you with every kind of financial and legal unpleasantness imaginable, to intimidate you into paying.

But, they can't actually do anything, for the same reason that a Nigerian e-mail scammer couldn't sue anyone who didn’t pay them.

What should I do then?

Continue to ignore everything you get from the PPC and their aliases. It does seem counter-intuitive to deal with something by ignoring it. Eventually, they will run out of empty threats, and stop throwing good money after bad.

notts_phil

just ignore it

its a scam invoice

also ignore all the threatening letters you may get or any phone calls

27col

I see that the Op is one of the rare ones, in that he did not call it a fine. So that's a good start. All you have to do now, is to ignore the PPC completely and the job's done.

paul1263

Thanks very much ,my son has a blue disabled badge as he is reg blind i should of taken him with me ,but the place was on my way home and i wanted to get back home asap , the chap was very ignorant and walked away and just grunted at me when i tried to explain i was in and out and i was very short of breath and struggling to walk , so i will ignore everything to do with them ,there was loads of parking spaces disabled and otherwise but i couldn't walk very far and i knew i wasn't taking one from a person that was reg disabled as there was so many empty ones near the door too . thanks for the quick responce once again.

Coupon-mad

paul1263 wrote: »

Thanks very much ,my son has a blue disabled badge as he is reg blind i should of taken him with me ,but the place was on my way home and i wanted to get back home asap , the chap was very ignorant and walked away and just grunted at me when i tried to explain i was in and out and i was very short of breath and struggling to walk , so i will ignore everything to do with them ,there was loads of parking spaces disabled and otherwise but i couldn't walk very far and i knew i wasn't taking one from a person that was reg disabled as there was so many empty ones near the door too . thanks for the quick responce once again.

You DO qualify to park there! You did not need to take your son.

Your condition means that you are considered protected disabled under the Equality Act 2010. You do not even need a Blue Badge on private land but these scam companies pretend you do 'cos it's the only way they can cope with disabled bays.

What they don't grasp is that they are actually breaching the Equality Act 2010 with their actions, if they discriminate against someone like you.

But it's only a matter of ignoring some junk mail - I am looking forward to getting some daft letters again trying to make me pay some PPC scammer! There is no court, no CCJ, no effect on your credit rating, NOTHING except letters (and sometimes the odd phone call that can be stopped easily).

Relax, it's just a fake PCN, ignore it (as long as it's not a company, hire or leased car). The registered keeper will get some letters, that's all, so make sure your household knows there is NOTHING in it in spite of the debt collector and 'solicitor' letter headings and threats of court. It's all hot air and an impersonation of authority, much like a phishing email scam it relies on victims who are too uninformed or stupid to realise what it is.

Tick off the threatening letters Here.

Watchdog clip with expert Solicitor's opinion here.

Barrister's opinion here.

Show your family and friends. Spread the word like we do. Only take seriously a real ticket from the Police, TFL, Council or (rarely) a real penalty from a Train Operator.

Anything else is destined for 'shredding for hamster-bedding'.

HTH

paul1263

Good i have enough to cope with ,with my wife passing away and raising our children on low income without the thought of paying out even more money when i can't afford even a decent standard of living ,i will look forward to their letters ,thanks everyone.

taffy056

Please don't worry about these low life scum bags, they are not worthy of it honestly. As coupon said you have a legal right to park there, all pathetic terms in a car park are superceeded by the equality act. Also view some recent watchdog videos for further reassurance .

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3164256

SodG24

paul1263 wrote: »

Good i have enough to cope with ,with my wife passing away and raising our children on low income without the thought of paying out even more money when i can't afford even a decent standard of living ,i will look forward to their letters ,thanks everyone.

As others have said, just ignore them. If you feel yourself waivering when you get the letters then come back here for reassurance. We've all had these fake invoices ( some naughty people have had dozens :eek: ) - you'll get support when needed from here.