Explanatory Memorandum for the Social Security Advisory Committee - 13th June 2012

Richie-from-the-Boro

Covering UC / PIP / JSAC / and ESAC is released

- a quick flick through the Claims and Payments Regulations suggests to me that Nat~gone~West will be nowt compared to 'online only' UC.

[Deleted User]

another recipe for disaster

Richie-from-the-Boro

woodbine wrote: »

another recipe for disaster

Some elements of the individual UC will be 4 week month others a calendar month can you begin to see the madness when people go from their current payment schedule to weekly / bi weekly or 4 weekly or calendar month payments ?

To make the above even more crazy most, as in nearly all claims will be electronic or telephone - no paper claims at all - once paper claims forms are used up no new paper claim forms will be printed. So people here could not for example take a part completed form to the CAB if it still exists for help to fill it out. In any case the GOV is quietly de-funding CAB offices by pulling their contracts - hence the reason they are closing all over the country.

Phone / email / or online personal benefit account the identities of claimants will need a secure verification to even talk about a claim - that's going to be fun too. What about couples rather than a single person claim ? is it going to be a joint or two single claims ? and when any money is paid which of the two accounts is the money going to go in if the couple hold separate accounts.

Rent payments as we already know will no longer be made to landlords under UC [unless exceptional circumstances] how are the DWP going to test that the claimant is capable ofmanaging their own finances ? Many claimants are in debt and don't even have bank account, or if they face insolvency will be unable to even set up a bank account. Those who lose a spouse or partner will unlike now cease to receive a payment. Marriage of the Polygamous kind will no longer be recognized.

What happens when the 4 week or calendar week is decided by the local authority for council tax and the separate UC claim decides its a different type of week calculation? Same goes when counting income who is going to use which of the week calculations? Ditto appeals an back payments. Ditto overpayment recovery situations.

What about the same calculation when into the pot comes the employer and the HMRC ?, under the new 'real time rules' employers will have to be very careful which week calculator they use or they will be responsible for any overpayment's if the are found to have contributed to the mistake.

NOTE: on P13 it states that "some exceptional payment arrangement cases will be referred to a human DM - can I assume that all other non-exceptional online applications will be decided by a~n~other version of electronic LiMA ?

Lots and lots of questions John .. .. not many answers, but yes they can't even run the current computer system without screwing everything up or loosing millions of personal files. Its bad enough now but if you don't receive a form / or / confirmation you can ask them to send it again, will the disabled and ill be able to do that electronically ?, and given the amount of times they lose papers or deny they ever received papers will that improve ?

Conclusion

Reading the interferences in the above and translating it into the everyday nuts & bolts of making a claim it seems to be the case that :

- a new one way only computerised claim system aka LiMA type will be used whether someone claims by phone or online
- we can assume that like LiMA it will be black & white no grey inflexible and inhuman system designed to get what GOV want to hear
- the years of coping with LiMA by additional info on separate sheets with accompanying evidence and eventual appeal will not be allowed

NOTE1: I'm not sure yet what ares of dispute will /will not be appeal~able ! such as / backdating / social fund / special circumstances / mortgage interest / etc

So the nuts & bolts of making a claim will be you (1) yourself fill in YES or NO box's into which you can get very little or (2) you answer YES or NO questions read to you from a script monkey who in turn fills in box's into which s/he can get very little - either way I can see it being a disaster.