Court Claim regarding Ebay Transaction

toao

Hi everyone,

Thanks for taking the time to read, Hope someone can help.

As part of my business we clear all our customer returned items on Ebay via a 99p no reserve auction, All items are sold as Faulty, We give a brief detailing of any physical damage and sometimes power the item on and detail any obvious faults, Right next to items description on every listing we state "Sold as faulty, no returns, refunds or negative feedback"

Some of the items we just dont have the ability to test so we have had some very good feedback from people who have purchased real bargains, All items are sold on an auction format with a 99p start so in theory people know they will be taking a risk and so bid accordngly.

However about 3 weeks ago we sold a printer (Probably worth about £100 if it was sold as working), It sold for £55 which we thought was quite alot for something sold as faulty but never the less it was clearly stated "Missing Duplexer, Powered on and display says "Printer error has occurred" sold as faulty, no returns, refunds or negative feedback".

A couple of days after sending the item we recieved a negative feedback (The first one we had recieved), Obviously we weren't best pleased and emailed the seller explaining that it was sold as faulty etc etc, Keen to keep our 100% feedback we stated that on this occasion we would offer a partial refund of £10 to try and resolve the matter so that both parties were happy and would be grateful if he would accept and remove the negative feedback.

From that point on the seller became very aggressive (On email not through ebay massaging) saying and i quote "You are trying to buy me to remove the feedback for £10" and that "Me and all me mates are going to bid on all your auctions and F*** things up for you"(At least i think thats what he put after correcting all the spelling mistakes). After recieving the threats we informed him that by bidding on our items he accepted our terms and conditions and that we were trying to come to an agreement where both parties would be satisfied but if he didnt want to come to some agreement then we would have no option to take court action to get the feedback removed and recover costs from him. His repsonse "Haha very funny, See you in court then you C***"

And so we issued court proceedings, We contacted ebay who were unwilling to do anything about the threats as they were done through email and not ebay messaging, We have therefore issued the proceedings and the threats have got worse, He his threatening physical violence. This is on email, He is however being civil through ebay messaging. So much so Ebay have now decided he can return the item for a refund!!!

I would ideally just like an end to this as its gone on for too long but refuse to be bullied. He has now issued a counterclaim for "Stress" that is all he has put in his counterclaim of £500?? (My claim was for £200 for loss of earnings due to not being able to list because of his threats and for the effect negative feedback will have on my sales).

Any ideas where i go from here? I hoped that issueing a court claim would make him see sense and try and resolve the issue with me but it had made things worse. How do i respond to the counterclaim "Stress"? the court papers say i have to file a "copy of my defence" and it must contain a "statement of truth" but there is no form to fill in, Where do i start? Also what information do i need to provide to the court and the defendant at this stage?

Thanks in advance for your help

soolin

Firstly I think any 'legal' issues concerning the court case and papers should be addressed by a fully qualified lawyer, no one on here should be advising you.

However, from an eBay and UK consumer law basis you have handled this very badly and it might pay you to take a step back and rethink your business model. Under consumer laws buyers have a perfect right to return goods for any reason if they purchase them online, none of your 'no returns, no refund' nonsense stops that. You are a business and as such need to comply with the relevant bits of this legislation. Also the 'no neg feedback' statement is just daft, drop it.

Buyer left a neg, that is unfortunate especially without prior contact and many of us business sellers here will sympathise and feel your pain. However offering to buy the neg away is not a good idea, it immediately makes you look guilty of something. Many of us would have contacted the buyer and offered a full and immediate refund if buyer cared to return item, and then asked for a feedback removal. There was even a good chance that as a business seller if you have a good strong seller dashboard that eBay would have removed the neg anyway if you had asked on the basis that buyer made no contact.

I would tread carefully here, especially in court if your own trading terms are in breach of UK consumer laws, but again suggest that your lawyer would be best placed to advise.

kurgon

Your terms are not enforceable and have often courted derision on here. You cannot state that no neg feedback can be left - nor as a business can you state no returns. You are bound by dsr. While the sellers behaviour has been extremely poor,it does not absolve you from your responsibilities.

vax2002

Both cases will be struck out and the DSR will be ruled in effect.
E.bay will refund the money.

This may not want you want to hear, but its the truth.

toao

thought distance selling regulations did not apply at auction, If they do how can a website like i-bidder carry out business?

toao

or rather the local auction houses that use i-bidder to sell customer returned items that use i-bidder?

To be honest i would have even resolved this to the buyers satisfaction to avoid any negative feedback but the buyer has not been prepared to negotiate in any way which is very dissapointing, and to recieve threats against my personal safety and my business is i believe not acceptable, I am conversant with ebay, I have been trading for over 4 years and have over 7000 feedback turning over approximately £200,000 per year at the present rate.

bris

DSR does not apply, a contract has been formed and terms and conditions may very well be deemed fair, as they were honest. OP you may very well have a case in a court despite what Ebay do, they are not above the law.

amcluesent

He his threatening physical violence.

Worth talking to the bizzies about that (they wouldn't be interested in the civil dispute).

TBH, the courts usually take a dim view of business using litigation, they reckon a business doesn't need hand-holding.

N.B Could this be a competitor trying it on?

Somerset

vax2002 wrote: »

E.bay will refund the money.

Just curious, why would ebay/paypal refund ? The buyer bought a faulty item & received a faulty item.

antrobus

toao wrote: »

...Any ideas where i go from here?

Yes. Drop the civil case. Forget about it. Move on. All your attempts to "resolve the issue" have only "made things worse" - that should be a hint.

I understand the business model - stick all your returns on eBay to get rid and make a few quid. But I think that you just have to accept that a certain percentage of the population are either (a) idiots, or (b) scamsters, (and sometimes even (c) both) and live with it. Or 'cost it into your business model' if you like. Or to put it another way; getting into a fight with an idiot is a lose-lose situation for a business. There are much better things for you to be spending your time on.

P.S. And read this story

Court threat over eBay feedback
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7689553.stm

Now I'm not sure what exactly happened to this case, but if you check the eBay profile for the seller 'Onsalexuk', you can see that they currently don't have a business selling anything on eBay.

toao

Thanks for your replies,

Definately not a competitor trying it on, The guy can hardly string a sentence together, Certaintly not without being threatening and abusive so dont think he would succeed in selling anything on Ebay with all the disputes and complaints that one has to resolve.

I really dont know why ebay/paypal are going to refund him, It was accurately described as faulty so as far as i'm concerned its very harsh. Also according to the buyer Ebay are giving him a statement or will be a witness in court which i cant quite believe as surely by there own "terms" they are only a platform for buyers and sellers.

To be honest i would forget the civil claim and move on, However if that is to be the case then i will report the threats to the police just incase and hopefully he would get a word of warning as there is no need to email the things he has when i have tried to be diplomatic, It has been near on death threats on a daily basis until ebay decided that they would refund him on return of the item, I'm broad shouldered but have a family and things like this do become a concern when they are constant with such descriptive threats.

Also if i did drop the civil case what would happen regarding the counter claim, Wouldnt that be like admitting myself being at fault and leave myself open to being counter claimed for "Stress"?