Overpayment & Disciplinary

bisselljk1986

Hi all,

Don't know if this is in the right place but here goes:

I need some advice on a number of overpayments I have received in my wages. To cut a VERY long story short I got a promotion and an "Acting Up" salary payment to go with it. Time went on, wages were increased, I then moved to a different department, years went by etc etc.

The Company have: 1) Advised me that the Acting Up payments should have stopped in line with one of my salary increases (about 5 years ago)

2) Decreased my wages

3) Sent me a recorded letter inviting me to a disciplinary claiming a breach of trust etc etc as I should have notified somebody I was being "overpaid".

My question is not so much around the overpayments and reduction in my salary - I can deal with that because I'd rather not be seen as somebody who causes a stir (taking legal advice would be seen as very unfavourable in this company - and they'd find a way to get me out of I were to "rock the boat"). I'm now worried sick about this disciplinary hearing. I cannot believe that somebody thinks I have been underhanded or dishonest!

I don't know what to do now, I will refute any claim they make that I have somehow been dishonest. If they say I have been overpaid and can prove it (they have also sent me a copy of a contract I signed when moving to the new department saying my wages were £x,000) then I will gladly make payments back. I just don't want to lose my job and I'm worried this is a way to kick me out for some reason.

Can anybody tell me whether it sounds like it may go down that route or am I over-stressing?

Sorry it's long!!

zzzLazyDaisy

Okay, let's look at this step by step...

Firstly, does the letter say that this alleged misconduct could potentially be viewed as gross misconduct under the company's disciplinary procedures and/or that you are at risk of dismissal if the allegations are proved to be well founded? If not, then it is unlikely that they are contemplating dismissal.

Secondly, in order to dismiss you fairly, under the law, the employer must carry out a thorough investigation, including giving you a fair chance to explain things from your point of view AND must come to an honest and reasonable belief that you are guilty of the misconduct complained of. Note they do not have to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you knew you were being overpaid and kept quiet, just that there is enough evidence to support a reasonable belief that this was the case.

So the question is - did you in fact know that your were being overpaid OR was it something that should have been obvious but that you might be seen to have turned a 'blind eye' (in other words, there was enough information for you to know that you were being overpaid but you chose to ignore it, or to not make the relevant enquiries).

On the other hand, if you honestly did not realise you were being overpaid and had no way of knowing - or at least it was reasonable that you could have overlooked/not realised this, then you should not be disciplined for this (providing the employer accepts your explanation). So it is important that you go to the interview prepared to explain why you did not realise what was happening (even if it was simnply that you filed your contract in a drawer without reading it properly).

I know from experience that it is possibly to make genuine mistakes with pay grades - many years ago in a new post, with numerous changes to my tax code, I failed to realise for almost a year that my employer was actually paying me at the rate for the grade one level down, than my actual grade and payscale. It took ages to sort out because by that time we'd flipped over into a new tax year.

Of course the reverse is also true, why didn't the employer pick up this error, particularly if there have been changes to payrates since then, surely it must have been apparent to the employer at that point that you were on the wrong payscale for the post?

With regard to the overpayment. An overpayment of wages does not fall within the 'unlawful deductions' rules, so even if there is no deductions clause in your contract, they are entitled to recover the overpayment from your wages.

On the information you have given us, I'd be surprised if you lose your job over this, unless the overpayment was so blatantly obvious that you couldn't have failed to notice it.

Good luck and let us know what happens.

getmore4less

What's the paper trail say for each of the changes.

Contracts, offer letters, payslips, pay structures etc.

Is the acting up identified seperately from the normal pay.
Were you getting paid more than the offers/grades for the new jobs.

fannyadams

Ask ACAS
they were really good to me when I was being made redundant.
HTH
FA
xx

MissSarah1972

They are blaming you for THEIR mistake! Wow!

IF you were over paid for so long there is only one person to blame and that would be the person who NEVER stopped the over payments.

mynameistallulah

MissSarah1972 wrote: »

They are blaming you for THEIR mistake! Wow!

IF you were over paid for so long there is only one person to blame and that would be the person who NEVER stopped the over payments.

If you receive money that you are not entitled to you have a duty to advise of the overpayment. It comes under the implied duty of mutual trust and confidence. If the OP was aware of the overpayment, he has in effect lied by omission for the past five years.

MissSarah1972

mynameistallulah wrote: »

If you receive money that you are not entitled to you have a duty to advise of the overpayment. It comes under the implied duty of mutual trust and confidence. If the OP was aware of the overpayment, he has in effect lied by omission for the past five years.

If it was £1000 a month more then I'd say yes you could not have missed that but it was was just £5 a week then I would say it was easily missed and I would ask the question why in 5 years when surely they have had a salary review no one at the company noticed?

vax2002

On loosing your job.
You do not start disciplinary measures against someone you intend to remain working for you, the chance of them upping sticks is too big a risk.
A informal chat and arrangement would suffice.
Act accordingly and start covering your bases, look for another job.

mynameistallulah

MissSarah1972 wrote: »

If it was £1000 a month more then I'd say yes you could not have missed that but it was was just £5 a week then I would say it was easily missed and I would ask the question why in 5 years when surely they have had a salary review no one at the company noticed?

Yes, the question of why the employer did not notice does need to be asked, no one has suggested otherwise. However, it does not take away from the fact that the employee also has a duty to check his pay is correct, so your assertion that there is "only one person to blame" is entirely wrong.

jobbingmusician

vax2002 wrote: »

On loosing your job.
You do not start disciplinary measures against someone you intend to remain working for you, the chance of them upping sticks is too big a risk.
A informal chat and arrangement would suffice.
Act accordingly and start covering your bases, look for another job.

absolute rubbish. A disciplinary is supposed to be a tool to help employees perform to the standard required.

jc808

jobbingmusician wrote: »

absolute rubbish. A disciplinary is supposed to be a tool to help employees perform to the standard required.

In the real world, its either used as a last resort (informal chats, then formal performance management, then disciplinary) and certainly not to rectify a payroll mistake.

I agree with Vax, the fact they have lumped straight in with a disiplinary means they want RID