MSE News: Unemployment to 'keep on rising'

cashbackproblems

Randvegeta wrote: »

That was a joke. Anubis was a character on a TV show, Stargate SG1. He was a system lord who enslaved many humans by making them believe he was an all powerful god.



I never said boarding or hostels were free. I'm saying that state provided benefits are effectively free. I hope you don't come to the wrong conclusion in the real world so often as you have in replying to my posts on this thread.



Wrong again. Tax evasion is ILLEGAL! I do not evade taxes. What I do is lawful. My company pays all the tax due in it's respective jurisdiction. I am avoiding tax by not drawing a salary. Nothing wrong with this. I'm not sure what the exact entitlements are (if any) but the fact I own a company is of little consequence. Own any shares in company? I don't owning shares excludes you from being entitled to unemployment and low income benefits.

And yes it may be choice, but so is it the choice of many to refuse to take certain jobs because they believe it is BELOW them. For example, a chemistry/pharmacy graduate may wish to take up employment in a field relevant to their degree. If such jobs are not available, they may well go on JSA and whatever other benefits an unemployed person may be eligible for. If the only work available is a factory worker, or toilet cleaner, or chip frier, and they DON'T take it. This is a choice! They have chosen NOT to work.



Indeed I don't want to be done for benefit fraud, but why would you say such a thing? 1. I don't claim any form of benefit. 2. What fraud would be committed were I to apply?



As opposed to yours which make perfect sense and arn't silly at all yes?

As I understand, you are in support of the welfare state, in support of people receiving benefits even if they choose not to work when work is available. Yet somehow my lawful actions to avoid tax is not acceptable to you, and my desire to change the system angers you in some way.

I thought this country was supposed to be tolerant. With people like you here, it's no wonder we are all going down hill.

It sounds like you are from Saudi or a middle eastern country, but you have to understand their populations are alot less and they have money from natural resources.

Also i dont agree with you above point, the country has part funded for someone to become a pharmacist through uni subsidies/high school education, so if that person is struggling to find a job in a chemist SHORT TERM it is not in our interests for them to become toilet cleaners, it is a waste of their skills and UK productivity, as those jobs should be done by those w/o degrees. Of course if there are NO pharmacy jobs it might be different but this is not the case and there are closer alternatives such as medical reps etc.

When people choose NOT TO WORK there are currently measures in place to force them on work schemes after 6 months, but its impossible for separate the work shy from those genuinely unable to work

Randvegeta

I think your being deliberatley inflammatory and silly to get a reaction.Im not responding again.

If you want to avoid the issue, provide nothing of value, and make rash prejudicial judgements based on your own closed mindedness, that's fine with me. (Clearly this post is deliberately inflammatory.. to YOU. My others posts genuinely reflect my views on society).

cashbackproblems wrote: »

It sounds like you are from Saudi or a middle eastern country, but you have to understand their populations are alot less and they have money from natural resources.

And what makes you say that? For the record, I am not from the middle east. 'My country', has little in the way of natural resources. truth be told, we have NO naturual resources. We have no gold, no oil, no diamonds, and virtually no agriculture either. It does have a thriving service sector, and an extremely free economy. I deplore those oil states!

Also i dont agree with you above point, the country has part funded for someone to become a pharmacist through uni subsidies/high school education, so if that person is struggling to find a job in a chemist SHORT TERM it is not in our interests for them to become toilet cleaners, it is a waste of their skills and UK productivity, as those jobs should be done by those w/o degrees. Of course if there are NO pharmacy jobs it might be different but this is not the case and there are closer alternatives such as medical reps etc.

I totally agree that it would be a complete waist of those skills. That being said, its even more wasteful to have a country invest so much into a person, and have them sit around for nothing. At least get SOME productivity out of a person.

Another issue to consider is, perhaps there are TOO many graduates in a particular field. What about people who take generic degrees? Degrees in geography, sport science, art history etc. All completely useless degrees for MOST jobs. They are not industry specific to justify 'waiting' for a well paid job, I don't think.

Engineering, medicine, pharmacy, computer science, etc.. These may justify holding out.. But partly because there is more demand for people with these kinds of qualifications. Particularly engineering and computing.

When people choose NOT TO WORK there are currently measures in place to force them on work schemes after 6 months, but its impossible for separate the work shy from those genuinely unable to work

Yes but it's not difficult to get around these 'measures' I don't think.

Perhaps they should also place some limitations on benefit payments for people who get fired, or quit.

My brother, for example, he works here in the UK. He hated his last job and decided to quit. Luckily, he got a better job very quickly, but had he not, he would have been claiming JSA and other benefits to keep himself afloat. Personally I don't think that is right. If you have a job, simply not enjoying the work is not a suitable reason to quit.

And this is my own brother I'm talking about!

cashbackproblems

Randvegeta wrote: »

If you want to avoid the issue, provide nothing of value, and make rash prejudicial judgements based on your own closed mindedness, that's fine with me. (Clearly this post is deliberately inflammatory.. to YOU. My others posts genuinely reflect my views on society).



And what makes you say that? For the record, I am not from the middle east. 'My country', has little in the way of natural resources. truth be told, we have NO naturual resources. We have no gold, no oil, no diamonds, and virtually no agriculture either. It does have a thriving service sector, and an extremely free economy. I deplore those oil states!



I totally agree that it would be a complete waist of those skills. That being said, its even more wasteful to have a country invest so much into a person, and have them sit around for nothing. At least get SOME productivity out of a person.

Another issue to consider is, perhaps there are TOO many graduates in a particular field. What about people who take generic degrees? Degrees in geography, sport science, art history etc. All completely useless degrees for MOST jobs. They are not industry specific to justify 'waiting' for a well paid job, I don't think.

Engineering, medicine, pharmacy, computer science, etc.. These may justify holding out.. But partly because there is more demand for people with these kinds of qualifications. Particularly engineering and computing.



Yes but it's not difficult to get around these 'measures' I don't think.

Perhaps they should also place some limitations on benefit payments for people who get fired, or quit.

My brother, for example, he works here in the UK. He hated his last job and decided to quit. Luckily, he got a better job very quickly, but had he not, he would have been claiming JSA and other benefits to keep himself afloat. Personally I don't think that is right. If you have a job, simply not enjoying the work is not a suitable reason to quit.

And this is my own brother I'm talking about!

No he wouldnt have, if you leave your job voluntarily you cant get JSA for at least 6 months.

Non specific degrees give you transferable skills and allow you to work in other industries its just that these "other" industries are not recruiting. For example lots of my uni friends who studied humanities have got good jobs e.g. one guy did Geography and works in accountancy for big4, another did sociology and is a recruitment consultant, another Philosophy and Art and is working as a trader! People taking generic degrees 5-10 years back did not foresee this recession so are now stuck and competing with people who have industry experience.

The way forward is not spending 40k on degrees, but offering more apprenticeships and training which Labour started doing especially to those not performing in school and creating new businesses with these skills in manufacturing, design, construction, sales etc.

Randvegeta

cashbackproblems wrote: »

No he wouldnt have, if you leave your job voluntarily you cant get JSA for at least 6 months.

You could be right. I'm not sure. I don't think you are. As I recall, my brother did this once before and was claiming benefits for several months.

Scenario was, he finished UNI, got a job. Hated his job and quit. Went on benefits for several months as he couldn't find any work. He then, eventually, took the same job (with a different company), only this time it was less pay, so guess what, he hated it more! And quit! Now he has a very similar job, but this time the money is good. He still hates his job but is sticking with it since he knows it's going to be hard to get a better job, particularly one as well paid.

In any case, the time between quitting his job and getting on benefits seemed a lot less than 6 months as I recall.

In any case, my points regarding the kinds of social welfare this country offers, and my suggestions, are not based on me wanting to discriminate, or segregate the rich from the poor, or privileged from under privileged, but to advocate a more affordable system that would ultimately be beneficial for more people.

This country has too much debt and a large budget deficit. Yes we can cut back on many things, perhaps defence and international aid, but these pale in comparison to the cost of the welfare system we have.

Some of you think it is fair to take 50% of a persons earnings! Some of you think it is unfair to tell someone they are getting a 5% tax cut (from 50 to 45) which only raising the tax allowance from 8,150 to 10,000, despite the fact that their percentage of tax is much MUCH lower.

If you ask me, the personal allowance should be at least minimum wage, and tax should be brought down as a whole, making it a flat 20 - 25% after the personal allowance.

The personal allowance for married couples should also be able to add up with each other.

Bring down the cost of the public sector and social welfare costs, and we can bring down taxes for all. People spend more money because they have more money TO spend, and that will stimulate the economy, creating jobs and bringing down unemployment!

Attractive tax rates for wealthy individuals will probably attract more wealthy people, or at the very least, stop the existing wealthy people from leaving. This, I believe, will lead to more spending, and more wealth held in the banks and other assets, which would ultimately lead to availability of funds to lend out to small businesses which in turn, stimulates the economy and create JOBS!

That's what I think at least.

And if someone disagrees, they could at least provide a proper explanation, instead of stupid answers like 'You're just being silly'. Comments like that don't help anyone.