Any car mechanics out there?

Peartree

I could do with some advice.

A few weeks ago, the driver's side window on my Vauxhall Meriva stuck fast at an inch or so open. I have a really good garage so whipped around there and left the car. When I went back the guy told me that it wasn't the motor (which had anyway been changed a couple of years ago). He thought it was the body control module as when he reset it the window worked again. He said it might have been a one off, and I should drive it and see if it happened again. It did. I went back, he reset it again (no charge for any of this by the way) and showed me how I could reset it myself by disconecting the battery for a few minutes. He said it would be better for me to take it to the Vauxhall dealer for repair as it could well need configuring and he'd have to go to Vauxhall to do that anyway.

So I went to my Vauxhall main dealer today. I told them what the other garage had said when I booked it in and when I took it in. I called them this afternoon to find out what was going on and was told it was a suspected faulty motor. Much discussion ensued with lots of faffing and calling backs. They were insistent that it was not the body control module as there was no fault code coming up in the diagnostic. I spoke to my garage again and he told me this is a known fault in Merivas and he's had experience of fault codes not showing up where they should before.

The upshot is that the Vauxhall dealer was adamant that it was the switch in the motor. My own garage maintains the motor is fine. My conversations with the dealer didn't leave me feeling confident as they didn't seem to be able to explain it all properly to me. So, I went back, paid the fee for the diagnostic and took the car away.

So what do I do now? Does anyone have any experience with this type of fault on a Vauxhall? I don't want to end up paying for a motor when it is the body control module or vice versa.

Strider590

Dealerships = 17yr old trainee with a laptop

They literally call you a liar if it doesn't present a fault code.

Your mechanic sounds a bit more "on the ball".

Fault sounds to me like the anti-pinch, this triggers if it thinks the window is obstructed, you need to find out why it thinks that.
There's a little device attached to the window mech, which counts in pulses how far up/down the window is, this is how it knows where the top and bottom points are for the AUTO feature..... I'd bet this device is somehow getting it wrong, could be as simple as dirt/dust, it fails to read, the control module gets confused and it crashes harder than Windows 95, i'd be worth gaining access and giving everything a really good blast of compressed air.

Sgt_Pepper_2

Strider590 wrote: »

Dealerships = 17yr old trainee with a laptop

So who's training them?

Peartree

Strider590 wrote: »

Dealerships = 17yr old trainee with a laptop

They literally call you a liar if it doesn't present a fault code.

Your mechanic sounds a bit more "on the ball".

Fault sounds to me like the anti-pinch, this triggers if it thinks the window is obstructed, you need to find out why it thinks that.
There's a little device attached to the window mech, which counts in pulses how far up/down the window is, this is how it knows where the top and bottom points are for the AUTO feature..... I'd bet this device is somehow getting it wrong, could be as simple as dirt/dust, it fails to read, the control module gets confused and it crashes harder than Windows 95, i'd be worth gaining access and giving everything a really good blast of compressed air.

That was my feeling about the dealership with absolutely no disrespect at all to the people working there - it is all in the training and experience. My understanding of cars is pretty minimal - although I was brought up in a home where my Dad kept a series of old bangers on the road so heard a lot of car talk - but my mechanic always takes the time to explain things in terms I can just understand in a non-patronising way - which is why he gets recommended to all my friends and colleagues.

I guess what I was looking for was some support for my own gut feel on this one. Your response is really helpful and I'll contact my mechanic to have a chat about it.

Peartree

Sgt_Pepper wrote: »

So who's training them?

Can we not derail my query with a row about training in dealerships? No disrespect, but it isn't helpful.

s_b

its a difficult call because it could well be the module or the motor
you dont say year of course which wouldnt help me but might help someone
you have to remember that your mechanic may be old school,(no offence) i use a sykes for vauxhalls but to interrogate properly you would need op com, seeing as im not a vaux fan these days i cant do much other than engine checks but op com would be able to interrogate and actually drive this motor
so dont think the dealer are hopeless here

Premier_2

Peartree wrote: »

I could do with some advice.

A few weeks ago, the driver's side window on my Vauxhall Meriva stuck fast at an inch or so open. I have a really good garage so whipped around there and left the car. When I went back the guy told me that it wasn't the motor (which had anyway been changed a couple of years ago). He thought it was the body control module as when he reset it the window worked again. He said it might have been a one off, and I should drive it and see if it happened again. It did. I went back, he reset it again (no charge for any of this by the way) and showed me how I could reset it myself by disconecting the battery for a few minutes. He said it would be better for me to take it to the Vauxhall dealer for repair as it could well need configuring and he'd have to go to Vauxhall to do that anyway.

So I went to my Vauxhall main dealer today. I told them what the other garage had said when I booked it in and when I took it in. I called them this afternoon to find out what was going on and was told it was a suspected faulty motor. Much discussion ensued with lots of faffing and calling backs. They were insistent that it was not the body control module as there was no fault code coming up in the diagnostic. I spoke to my garage again and he told me this is a known fault in Merivas and he's had experience of fault codes not showing up where they should before.

The upshot is that the Vauxhall dealer was adamant that it was the switch in the motor. My own garage maintains the motor is fine. My conversations with the dealer didn't leave me feeling confident as they didn't seem to be able to explain it all properly to me. So, I went back, paid the fee for the diagnostic and took the car away.

So what do I do now? Does anyone have any experience with this type of fault on a Vauxhall? I don't want to end up paying for a motor when it is the body control module or vice versa.

I would first say I don't have specific knowledge of your particular car.

However, I'm as confused as you appear to be about this fault.
I'm not sure excatly what your local mechanic is doing when hes says he 'resets' the BCM. Is he just clearing the DTCs? (fault codes), as it is clear he doesn't have the necessary skills or equipment to reflash the BCM. So it might be useful to understand what those DTCs are that he is clearing.

Whatever the DTCs, I am very tempted to agree with the main dealer in that the root cause of the fault is probably not the BCM (or its software) as I don't understand how this would cause the window to not operate at all.
Having said that, I don't understanmd either why claering the DTC then allows the window to operate correctly, albeit only for a short time.

As I said, I don't know your specific vehicle, but typically electric windows operate using a very primative system. i.e. the motor only stops when the window is fully open/closed because the motor stalls. Of course this also occurs if the window sticks for any reason (e.g. an obstruction for safety reasons) but if the mechanism is sticking for any reason then that could also cause the motor to stall ... but that shouldn't stop the window working completely as you describe.

What could be happening is that the window is sticking for some reason, the motor is not cutting out quick enough and so fails due to stalling. This is typically controlled via a fuse, either simple electrical or heat activated fuse within the motor.
Perhaps your particular vehicle not only protects the motor by a heat sensitive fuse, but then stops all operation of the motor again until a fault cose is reset (on the assumption a mechanic would investigate why the fault occurred in the first place, not just clear the DTC)

To save face, what I would suggest is that you take your car to a different Vauxhall main dealer, explain the window doesn't operate and ask them to fix it. Don't tell the new dealership any of the history of what the local mechanic or the other dealership said. If the garage say it needs a new motor, (or anything else) simply agree to it but only on the clear understanding of the dealership that any work authorised will fully rectify the fault. i.e. once the dealership has examined the issue, get them to provide an agreed fixed price to rectify the fault

Strider590

Premier wrote: »

To save face, what I would suggest is that you take your car to a different Vauxhall main dealer, explain the window doesn't operate and ask them to fix it. Don't tell the new dealership any of the history of what the local mechanic or the other dealership said. If the garage say it needs a new motor, (or anything else) simply agree to it but only on the clear understanding of the dealership that any work authorised will fully rectify the fault. i.e. once the dealership has examined the issue, get them to provide an agreed fixed price to rectify the fault

Having worked for the company that makes the window systems for the likes of Ford, Honda and Mercedes, I can tell you that what the OP is experiencing is unfortunately more than possible, particularly the reset of the control module causing a temporary fix.

Taking the vehicle to another dealership will only result in different people working from the same fault finding help sheet/flowchart, diagnosing the problem in exactly the same way.