ESA - advice please

smileytiger

fogartyblue. wrote: »

Am I right in thinking that appeals are not in the main being made because people think they are in the wrong group, but because if they don't appeal they will lose money?

In which case I would imagine that everybody who is in the Work Group will be putting in an appeal!!

Is that justified even where it is clear to everyone including the claimant that the Work Group is the correct group to be in?

As for the OP, the claimant has been in the Work Group since Feb 2010 - 2 years! Why didn't they appeal against that decision two years ago?

This appears to be an underhanded appeal, not lodged for the right reason but lodged purely for financial reasons!

If I'm thinking that, surely the DWP will also be considering it.

If you read my post correctly i think you'll find it's actually not all about the money as i'm selling my house to have money to live on!!
I've never appealed before as i didn't understand the benefits system - i didn't know i could appeal. So sorry for being 2 hard working adults who have the audacity to ask for help.
Why are people so damn quick to judge.
I'm sorry my OH will never work again - maybe if you suddenly wake up one morning and find your life turned upside down and need your spine replacing in 2 places - you might understand what we've been through for 2 long years.
I can't bear people who fleece the system - but i certainly didn't think that we were doing that.
Hey ho - we're obviously just another scrounging couple trying top live the high life at the tax payers expense - man - you know jack!

fogartyblue.

rogerblack wrote: »

Or alternatively, because they did not understand initially that the decision was wrong.
The criteria of ESA are complex, and not well understood by claimants.
They are not well explained on the form, or on the decision notices, or at the medical.

Appealing against an incorrect decision is stressful, and may involve significant paperwork - which many may not bother with - even if they are entitled.

Now that is stretching things ......................!

If my memory serves me right, a few years ago, everybody was jumping up and down to be given the Work Group and not fail! Now those same people are appealing the decision, because they were put in the wrong group!! Come on, if I can see through this charade I'm sure the Tribunal Service and the DWP can!!

fogartyblue.

smileytiger wrote: »

If you read my post correctly i think you'll find it's actually not all about the money as i'm selling my house to have money to live on!!
I've never appealed before as i didn't understand the benefits system - i didn't know i could appeal. So sorry for being 2 hard working adults who have the audacity to ask for help.
Why are people so damn quick to judge.
I'm sorry my OH will never work again - maybe if you suddenly wake up one morning and find your life turned upside down and need your spine replacing in 2 places - you might understand what we've been through for 2 long years.
I can't bear people who fleece the system - but i certainly didn't think that we were doing that.
Hey ho - we're obviously just another scrounging couple trying top live the high life at the tax payers expense - man - you know jack!

For a start ignorance is no excuse in law. Besides which you would have received letters with the award telling you what to do if you thought that it was wrong. Didn't read them? Yeah!

Why don't you be honest and admit that the appeal has nothing to do with the assessment process of being put in the work group, but more to do with trying anything to hang on to a benefit that you think you should have! What would you call that if it's not trying to play the system?

oldhand

fogartyblue. wrote: »

For a start ignorance is no excuse in law. Besides which you would have received letters with the award telling you what to do if you thought that it was wrong. Didn't read them? Yeah!

Why don't you be honest and admit that the appeal has nothing to do with the assessment process of being put in the work group, but more to do with trying anything to hang on to a benefit that you think you should have! What would you call that if it's not trying to play the system?

I would be inclined to believe the lady,ignorance may be no excuse in law but many of those same benefit laws seem to have been thought up by people very ignorant to circumstances which of course in their ivory towers will never be applied to them.
I dont doubt there are many people in the WRAG group trying to jump ship to the support group for financial reasons but not many I would hazard who are already selling their home regardless,I assume you are in a more privileged position.Remember also in amongst those in the WRAG group are people suffering life changing illnesses,including cancer sufferers who were placed in that group even though doctors and consultants gave their expert medical opinion but were overruled by nothing more than a box ticker at a "medical" and a faceless "decision maker" in an office.

gingergee

Whats the main difference between WRAG and support?? I personally want to work again (even though docs etc keep telling me i wont). x Is there a huge difference?? xx

smileytiger

fogartyblue. wrote: »

For a start ignorance is no excuse in law. Besides which you would have received letters with the award telling you what to do if you thought that it was wrong. Didn't read them? Yeah!

Why don't you be honest and admit that the appeal has nothing to do with the assessment process of being put in the work group, but more to do with trying anything to hang on to a benefit that you think you should have! What would you call that if it's not trying to play the system?

Tell you what then if you're so smart - find an employer willing to take my OH on & he'd go back to work in a heartbeat if it meant he wasn't stuck indoors on his own all the time as i work all hours. But hang on i'm wasting my breath aren't i cos all i want is benefits.
Actually what i want is my husband to get better and live a normal life - i would give every penny i have for that.
I'm wasting my time so lets agree to differ - you don't know me or i you - so i shall say no more.

fogartyblue.

smileytiger wrote: »

Tell you what then if you're so smart - find an employer willing to take my OH on & he'd go back to work in a heartbeat if it meant he wasn't stuck indoors on his own all the time as i work all hours. But hang on i'm wasting my breath aren't i cos all i want is benefits.
Actually what i want is my husband to get better and live a normal life - i would give every penny i have for that.
I'm wasting my time so lets agree to differ - you don't know me or i you - so i shall say no more.

So why are you appealing if it has nothing to do with money?
Why not be honest?

smileytiger

fogartyblue. wrote: »

So why are you appealing if it has nothing to do with money?
Why not be honest?

If you actually READ my OP - i haven't even started an appeal - i said DWP advised me to - not that i had.
I asked for advice & i've taken yours on board - when have i not been honest.???

I am gonna stop rising to this now - as you're obviously getting some weird kick out of making me feel bloody awful when i have done nothing wrong. please go witch hunt somewhere else.

Queries

Dear smileytiger, I would certainly appeal if it is in your best interests and I wish you all the best. Also, it may be worth contacting the CAB (Citizens Advice Bureau) for additional help when appealing (you may even be able to get advice online -via their website - although I admit I am not totally sure about that). Good Luck!

fogartyblue.

Queries wrote: »

Dear smileytiger, I would certainly appeal if it is in your best interests and I wish you all the best. Also, it may be worth contacting the CAB (Citizens Advice Bureau) for additional help when appealing (you may even be able to get advice online -via their website - although I admit I am not totally sure about that). Good Luck!

Since when did it become appropriate to 'appeal if it is in your best interests'.

Surely the appeal should be limited to the fact that based on the evidence submitted at the time of the original decision, it was felt (at that time) that they had been classified in the wrong group.

It cannot be right to start appeal proceedings now after already accepting the Work Group for two years, on the basis of the loss of benefit come April. That is definitely not a legitimate ground for appealing - it is simply an effort to try and keep the ESA rolling in given the law as it stands.

The claimant would have to show that, based on medical evidence, that they should be in the Support Group. Could the question be raised then - why has it taken 2 years and another assessment to arrive at that belief?

This scenario is very similar to the 'jumping ship' from JSA to ESA after 6 months knowing that they could carry on getting another contributory benefit. Many tried that tactic, many came unstuck with it.