Renewables: "talking 'bout my generation"

ispookie666

0.5 O's yest and 1.0 O's today.
Waiting for the panel cleaner from nature - we do get that often
Has anyone used DRONES to inspect the panels?

legoman62

Cloudy with rain most of the day here today = 0.85 O's:D

Rumour has it, tomorrow will be sunny all day:drool::laugh:

Received my FIT payment of £116.29 from Eon in 4 working days:T

Oscargrouch

Crowmann wrote: »

Anyone know which is the truth?

Generation Meter only; but does not show peak...

legoman62 wrote: »

Cloudy with rain most of the day here today = 0.85 O's:D

Rumour has it, tomorrow will be sunny all day:drool::laugh:

Received my FIT payment of £116.29 from Eon in 4 working days:T

Sh*t, thought I was doing bad for putting in mine the morrow £111.74p at the mo..:mad:......

Martyn1981

Crowmann wrote: »

Your loft in summer will be unbearably hot even on an overcast day. In direct sunlight 40deg plus when outside is 20 would be my experience.

Sounds about right.

Crowmann wrote: »

I find it bizarre that the simple truth that un insulated lofts (that is lift un insulated from solar gains) get hot - very hot in peak summer should be contentious.

As a chartered surveyor for nearly 25 years who has had the misfortune to inspect lofts and their structure in the summer I can assure anyone ignorant of the ambient conditions of your summer time loft - they are best avoided between June and August, even in dear old Blighty.

Sounds about right too.

But for some reason you have ignored mine, and others comments that the rooves are no longer 'un-insulated'! And I'm not referring to my converted loft, but to the 'thermal shielding' that now covers 90% of my rooves in the form of PV.

To repeat what I've already said, but this time using your example, if the ambient temp is 20C and the direct sunlight is being borne by the PV panels (which may be at 40C but I'd suspect higher), why would the loft ambient be more than 20C?

To use my black car example, would you agree on a clear day, when the ambient temp is 20C that it may be too painful to touch a black van? However, if you walked around into the shade of the van (20C) would it now be too painful to stand there?

Why are you ignoring the experience and reports from those with PV telling you that the ambient temps are now lower?

And I'm not arguing with the logic of roof temps without PV, I'm simply pointing out that the addition of PV changes the information on which you are making (pre-PV) assumptions. Yet we can assume that an inverter will result in PV between the loft and the main focus of the sun. For most installs that will probably mean most of the roof area (though I covered my back on this (and larger properties) in a previous response).

Crowmann wrote: »

If you ever have a choice choose some where else, myself the downstairs cloak room.

Crowmann wrote: »

The last place anyone should fit an inverter is the loft. Simples. That folk have them there is down to expedience by installers and ignorance on the part of the client.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as to say it's the last place, but I agree that a cooler location should certainly be considered, which is exactly what I did, however, if you go back to the start of this discussion and your statement, I simply explained why the loft may be chosen, and why that might not be a bad decision if no more suitable location can be found.

A couple more examples for you in response to other points you raised:

Crowmann wrote: »

These things need to be kept cool(1), secondarily any heat source should be kept inside the habited space for efficiency(2)?

(1) On a very steep roof (50d) more gen will shift from hot months to cold months, so (whilst debateable) the inverter may be operating in a colder environment for half it's gen, balancing out the fact that leccy items don't like hot locations.

(2) You mentioned having the inverter (heat source) within the habited space. My downstairs toilet is unheated, and the inverters generate quite a lot of heat. However, 3/4 of that generation (waste heat) is during the non heating months, and the small window is left open to get rid of the heat, as it's a nuisance, not a benefit.

I apologise if you think I'm being difficult, I'm simply trying to show that life is not that simple, something I said in my first response to you, and that there are reasons for considering (not necessarily choosing) a loft install.

Mart.

Martyn1981

Crowmann wrote: »

7Kw today - pretty much overcast but with a moment (well probably more than a moment) of warm sunshine when the solar meter said 4310 watts.


Now this is more than the panels can in theory chuck out and when I checked the inverter it said 3600 watts.


Perplexing, my hunch is the power meter is correct (wishful thinking perhaps?) as the system records always more production on the wired meter than the inverter records.


Anyone know which is the truth?

The biggest clue here I think is you said an overcast day, so I assume the spike happened when the sun popped out from behind a cloud. At that point you get cloud edge lensing which can focus sunlight, and the panels would have been nice and cold.

When that happens you can often get generation of 110% (or so) of panel rating (unless you have a capped inverter), but it will be for a short period, perhaps only 10 seconds or so.

This means it can show up on an instantaneous device (I have LED monitors on my TGM's) but won't show up on anything that displays an average figure as the spike gets rounded out.

I've often seen 3,700W+ from my 3,580W ESE. I notice it because the room lights up with the sunburst*, prompting me to swivel my head and look at the monitor read out for that brief period when it spikes. I still find that entertaining.

[Edit: * sunburst is the wrong term. I should have said the sudden brightening before our eyes correct. So whilst it stays bright, you get that brief moment when you notice the sudden change. M.]

Mart.

Markj1110

Exiled_Tyke wrote: »

Not sure if it helps but I've run an ethernet cable from the inverter to the wi-fi/modem box for mine.

Thats what I did with mine as well.

0.43 O's yesterday, Dull and windy!

ajbell

Just got an email from First-Utility saying that my first reading of my generation meter will be required but payment is 8 weeks later on last friday in May, is this normal?. And Junes reading will be paid last friday in August.

edwink

ajbell wrote: »

Just got an email from First-Utility saying that my first reading of my generation meter will be required but payment is 8 weeks later on last friday in May, is this normal?. And Junes reading will be paid last friday in August.

I am not sure if that is normal for First Utility but it does seem rather a long time to me. Several of us on here are with Eon and they have been known to pay in a week or just under. My last payment was 5 days from them.

I am sure others will be along later to give you some idea of how long their payments take to come through.

HTH

Edwink

Rheumatoid

edwink wrote: »

I am sure others will be along later to give you some idea of how long their payments take to come through.

HTH

Edwink

Co-op submitted 16/12 still not paid!

michaels

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Sounds about right.



Sounds about right too.

But for some reason you have ignored mine, and others comments that the rooves are no longer 'un-insulated'! And I'm not referring to my converted loft, but to the 'thermal shielding' that now covers 90% of my rooves in the form of PV.

To repeat what I've already said, but this time using your example, if the ambient temp is 20C and the direct sunlight is being borne by the PV panels (which may be at 40C but I'd suspect higher), why would the loft ambient be more than 20C?

To use my black car example, would you agree on a clear day, when the ambient temp is 20C that it may be too painful to touch a black van? However, if you walked around into the shade of the van (20C) would it now be too painful to stand there?

Why are you ignoring the experience and reports from those with PV telling you that the ambient temps are now lower?

And I'm not arguing with the logic of roof temps without PV, I'm simply pointing out that the addition of PV changes the information on which you are making (pre-PV) assumptions. Yet we can assume that an inverter will result in PV between the loft and the main focus of the sun. For most installs that will probably mean most of the roof area (though I covered my back on this (and larger properties) in a previous response).






I'm not sure I'd go as far as to say it's the last place, but I agree that a cooler location should certainly be considered, which is exactly what I did, however, if you go back to the start of this discussion and your statement, I simply explained why the loft may be chosen, and why that might not be a bad decision if no more suitable location can be found.

A couple more examples for you in response to other points you raised:



(1) On a very steep roof (50d) more gen will shift from hot months to cold months, so (whilst debateable) the inverter may be operating in a colder environment for half it's gen, balancing out the fact that leccy items don't like hot locations.

(2) You mentioned having the inverter (heat source) within the habited space. My downstairs toilet is unheated, and the inverters generate quite a lot of heat. However, 3/4 of that generation (waste heat) is during the non heating months, and the small window is left open to get rid of the heat, as it's a nuisance, not a benefit.

I apologise if you think I'm being difficult, I'm simply trying to show that life is not that simple, something I said in my first response to you, and that there are reasons for considering (not necessarily choosing) a loft install.

Mart.

We have a TV signal booster and a gigabit hub in the loft. The later stops working when it gets really hot requiring a trek up the ladder to reboot it.

It does worry me having electrical devices up there with no smoke detectors and flammable boarding and trusses.