Can the NHS for us to do this re cars?

Fruity1

Hi, just wondering if there is anyone with any insight into the NHS car expenses and car leasing knowledge?

I have for 4yrs worked in the community for a Primary Care Trust. I have always had my own car for which I get paid a regular users allowance and 44p a mile as it is over 1500cc. Without consultation the trust has started sending out letters to staff stating that because they do too many miles for work they have to either sign up for a lease car or accept public transport rate for fuel. They are stating that it is for anyone who does more than 291 miles a month. This only allows 14.5 miles a day to do visits and being as we work in a very rural location this can sometimes not even cover one visit.

It appears that they are sending out a couple of letters a month and they have so far sent them to staff who have older vehicles and may be interested in a new car. Being as we had no prior notice I had had a new car last autumn and am reluctant to now sign up for a lease car especially as my average private mileage is 16,000. Sadly rumour is that if we become a Foundation Trust they will just change our contracts to make us do this even if we appeal now.

I intend to contact my union this week for further advice but would be grateful if anyone is knowledgeable in this area.



Sorry should say 'force' not for.

pineapple

OP you might want to take a look at your subject heading!
Are they supplying a free lease car (because I don't know how they can make you pay for one). But there again you would be taxed on that I believe.
One for the unions I think.

waynedance

Can the NHS for us to do this re cars? Errrmm

atrixblue.-MFR-.

think this would be a subject for the employment thread.

i think your issue is that you feel forced into leasing a car or make public transport a option to visit patiens/customers.

i dont think 14 miles per day is an reasonable high end target youve been subject or could possibly be subject to, knowing someone who worls as a private care agent using her own car and covering approx 400miles + per month.

leasing a car isnt an option for debt related people, so i'm assuming they are thinking that all employee's have a possotive credit score or easily able to afford to enable them to hire a car long term.

public transport cant be seen as reliable to meet appointment times and cost affective.

i would seek your union rep, have they been informed of this? and what action have been taken by your union and why wasnt a consultation held locally at your office?

Fruity1

Thanks for the replys. Yes apologies it should say force not for.

We could not reach a large percentage of our patients by public transport or manually carry all our kit around so that is not an option. We do have to pay for the lease as they will not give us crown cars for work use only and we will be taxed upon them as they are seen as a 'perk'. Will speak to the union today. Thanks again.

getmore4less

what is "public transport rate".

I looked it up

http://www.nhsemployers.org/PayAndContracts/AgendaForChange/Pages/Afc-MileageAllowances.aspx

looking at the T&C's
http://www.nhsemployers.org/SiteCollectionDocuments/AfC_tc_of_service_handbook_fb.pdf

section 17
have good read and all relevent apendix.

this implies that if no public transport available then they can't use that rate for those trips.

17.10 Standard or regular user rates of mileage allowance shall not apply if an

employee uses a private motor vehicle in circumstances where travel by

public transport would be appropriate. For such journeys the public

transport rate set out in Annex L shall be paid, unless this is higher than

the standard or regular user rate for the appropriate engine band, when

that lower rate should be paid.


Lease car policies

1. Local lease car schemes should take into account the following principles:

i. the scheme is voluntary and is offered to eligible employees;

ii. employees shall be charged the full cost for private use;

iii. schemes should provide for lease cars to be accepted on the basis

of business only use or a combination of business and private use.

Where cars are accepted for business use only these cars should be

classed as ‚pool‛ cars.

getmore4less

Follow up

17.4 says they can do this.
17.4 The rate of reimbursement in paragraph 1 in Annex L will apply if an employee unreasonably declines the employers’ offer of a lease car.

Annex L

Mileage allowances
[FONT=Frutiger LT 45 Light,Bold]
1. Public transport rate[/FONT]24p per mile

The only defence might be the use of the mileage for the cutoff is far to low to be in the interests of the trust so the request to use lease cars is unreasonable.

Joe_Horner

getmore4less wrote: »

Lease car policies

1. Local lease car schemes should take into account the following principles:

i. the scheme is voluntary and is offered to eligible employees;

getmore4less wrote: »

17.4 says they can do this.
17.4 The rate of reimbursement in paragraph 1 in Annex L will apply if an employee unreasonably declines the employers’ offer of a lease car.

That's a funny definition of "voluntary". Not sure "accept or lose out" counts.

That 24p per mile "public Transport rate" is WELL below the average actual cost per mile of running a car so I'd be a little annoyed, and expect m union to be as well, if they tried to impose it on my business mileage. It would be effectively subsidising them out of m own pocket to the tune of maybe 10 to 15 pence per mile, which adds up!

Lum

"unreasonably" bloody weasel words.

In the eyes of the average person on the street, the fact that you've just financed a new car specifically for work use would make it reasonable to decline the lease car.

In the eyes of a government bureaucrat who can probably afford to buy a brand new Golf in cash with their christmas bonus, probably not.


However, if they are just offering the scheme to people running older cars then they may well be being reasonable about it. They might be trying to encourage those with cars perceived as unreliable into newer cars so that they don't have to cancel appointments last minute due to a breakdown.

That said, my 2010 Ford has been on a tow truck much more often than my 1993 Nissan that I bought in 2008

molerat

Tell them you want a pool car for business use only, if you all did that they would likely think twice about it.

My BIL as maint eng had an estate car from work, ideal as the family car as well. The company decided they were going to change to vans as cheaper. All the engs asked where the company were going to park the 12 vans at night as none of them had space to park 2 vehicles at home, soon changed their minds.

mcfisco

That 24p per mile "public Transport rate" is WELL below the average actual cost per mile of running a car so I'd be a little annoyed,

Don't forget, you can also claim tax relief on the difference between 24p and 40p for the first 10K miles each year