Why should healthcare be 'free'?

lostinrates

I think our a and e aint bad actually. I think its pretty good. But its opart if the point i made. And also that private hospitals fall short of staffing requirements for routine proceedures (ie junior doctors) and equipment).

markharding557

I believe the only healthcare which should be free is that which is required to maintain health.
It should not be providing any non essential services such as cosmetic surgery, abortions, fat reductions (get their fat backsides doing some exercise) and absurdly expensive drugs.
Fines for missed appointments to deter time wasters.
No health tourism.

Generali

markharding557 wrote: »

I believe the only healthcare which should be free is that which is required to maintain health.
It should not be providing any non essential services such as cosmetic surgery, abortions, fat reductions (get their fat backsides doing some exercise) and absurdly expensive drugs.
Fines for missed appointments to deter time wasters.
No health tourism.

That's pretty much how the system works in Aus: you get basic care 'free' from the state. If you bust yourself up playing sport for example they'll mend any broken bones, give you a prescription for painkillers (you can reclaim the cost against your tax), lend you crutches or a wheelchair etc. The state will not pay for physiotherapy however so if you need/want that then you'll have to pay.

Mr_Mumble

Loughton_Monkey wrote: »

... just before you do....

It might be wise to check where the nearest private ambulance service is based - from where you propose having a road accident.

Us taxpayers would end up picking up the bill to clean up all that blood you spilled over the road during the 3 hours after the NHS Ambulance found out you're private and left you there.

The private insurer would pick up the bill for the ambulance.

A&E is a very small part of NHS cost, 'only' £1.9bn out of the £53bn in reference costs (I've tried to look for the other £70bn in costs but that's beyond my google skills - the NHS seem to hide the pertinent data but I did find out about the equality analysis for the 2012 heat wave!).

chucknorris

Generali wrote: »

That's pretty much how the system works in Aus: you get basic care 'free' from the state. If you bust yourself up playing sport for example they'll mend any broken bones, give you a prescription for painkillers (you can reclaim the cost against your tax), lend you crutches or a wheelchair etc. The state will not pay for physiotherapy however so if you need/want that then you'll have to pay.

Don't get me wrong I am well to the right when it comes to the economy, however I am more towards the centre (even left of it?) when it comes to health and education. I think poor people with mental illness (and with other medical problems) should be treated too.

What is your impression of the system in Australia? Does it seem to work (for everyone/most) better than our NHS?

Generali

chucknorris wrote: »

Don't get me wrong I am well to the right when it comes to the economy, however I am more towards the centre (even left of it?) when it comes to health and education. I think poor people with mental illness (and with other medical problems) should be treated too.

What is your impression of the system in Australia? Does it seem to work (for everyone/most) better than our NHS?

I think it really does: outcomes are better despite the challenges of providing healthcare to such a geographically dispersed country.

My belief is that by concentrating on the important things, Australia is much better equipped to provide good healthcare outcomes to Australians. I think it helps that healthcare is provided on a State level rather than a national level as it means that the system is much less unwieldy than the UK one. Also, Australia hasn't got to the point (yet???) where most of her citizens expect the Government to solve all their ills unlike in the UK which means that expectations of what a health service can deliver are reasonable.

The only healthcare that is particularly badly delivered in Australia is mental health care but IME that is the same across the whole world. Certainly mental healthcare in Aus is no worse than in the UK but it could be a lot better.

James_N

Generali wrote: »

I don't understand what is unique about healthcare that pretty much everyone in the UK thinks that it should be free at the point of use.

I've been on the planet for about 15,000 days and have needed to drink water on pretty much all of those days, eat food at least a couple of times a week, have shelter and warmth and yet it is considered normal for me to pay for those things which keep me alive.

I've only really had one lot of life saving medical treatment in those 15,000 and even that is debatable. I guess to that you should add vaccination and prophylactic drugs against malaria (both of which are incredibly cheap to buy). Most of the healthcare I had was to make my life a bit easier or nicer, even just to get a medical certificate so the boss didn't sack me for having a particularly nasty cold (or 'the flu' as it seems to be known these days).

Surely if there is an argument for anything being free at the point of use it should be these greater essentials. So why pick out healthcare? I don't get it.

I am glad you have had such an easy time of it, healthwise. Others have not.
I am surprised you cannot see the benefits to society generally, or to the individual of free-at-point of need healthcare. The rise of society's ability to stand well in terms of health since 1947 brings economic and social benefits to all.
And you misunderstand free-at-point of need. Look at your pay slip. See that entry for NI? That's a part insurance / part assurance compact with the government to provide various services, some of which you will use and some you may be lucky enough not to use. You don't have a pay-slip perhaps? That means ** I ** am paying for you too.

kabayiri

NI as a concept : a ring fenced tax for specific state provision, is out of date and should be scrapped.

It has become merely a second level of personal taxation, used when government wishes to 'disguise' increases to income tax.

ruggedtoast

I have no problems paying tax for the NHS.

I have a big problem with being forced to pay for the very fat.

In fact I would go as far as to say that the very fat should have to pay extra taxes on food, much like smokers pay on tobacco, to cover their nhs treatment.

Generali

James_N wrote: »

I am glad you have had such an easy time of it, healthwise. Others have not.
I am surprised you cannot see the benefits to society generally, or to the individual of free-at-point of need healthcare. The rise of society's ability to stand well in terms of health since 1947 brings economic and social benefits to all.
And you misunderstand free-at-point of need. Look at your pay slip. See that entry for NI? That's a part insurance / part assurance compact with the government to provide various services, some of which you will use and some you may be lucky enough not to use. You don't have a pay-slip perhaps? That means ** I ** am paying for you too.

If you think that NI covers the cost of the welfare state then you should retake your maths GCSE,