Electric shower not powerful enough if water being used elsewhere in house???

keystone

toofy wrote: »

Meant to say I've had another couple of cowboys out who dabbled about under the sink, and removed what they called a gas valve from under the stopcock, although this did nothing to change the pressure.

A gas valve is for gas not for water. LoL.

They didn't instill any faith in me,

I'm not surprised. What was it that they actiually removed? A non return valve, a fow restrictor, a pressure reducing valve.

and charged me £45 for what I could see was 10 mins work. They also spent an hour and a half talking absolute dribble, so I really am looking for some sound advice...

They charged you £ 45 for an hour and a half which is cheap for two bodies part of which was spent talking drivel and part of which was set removing something.

Have you checked the internal pressure using a pressure guage? Simplest place is at your washing machine tap as the pressure guage will have a 3/4" BSP connection? Have you checked that your stopcock and the water company's stopcock are properly open (thats open as far as it can then close by about 1/4 turn)?

Cheers

toofy

Thanks for the reply...to be honest I'm not really sure, the plumbers had a guage they put to the kitchen tap, the same as the Water Service guy ..they both said it was showing 9 or 10 litres.

My first plumber thought that, as it was an old house the pipes feeding the main could be lead & therefore not fit for the purpose. He did not give me any insight to any solution other than to rip up the floor and refit new pipes, (at a much greater expense.) Now with the Water Service saying the mains pressure is acceptable I am thinking it's a problem with the pipes running from the kitchen to the bathroom above. As soon as I turn on one tap on the bath, and then the other the flow dies.

The house is vacant at the moment as we are working on it for my son, but I'm reticent to go any further until we get this sorted as I don't want to have to rip up tiling or floors to fix the problem..The second set of plumbers (they came together), took away the gas valve thing beside the stopcock under the kitchen sink and walked away from it saying it was a Water Service problem (I really did not have any faith in them anyhow)..the shower I have purchased to fit is a Triton Fast-Fit 9.5kw.. ( it didn't need to be anything special as it would be students in the house) - have I wasted my time/money? Is there anything can be done to sort this problem?

toofy

The original plumber (No.1) has already put the pipes in place for the electric shower, and installed the bath, sink and toilet as we had ripped the old ones out.. but left saying he couldn't get the pressure sorted..so I'm not particularly happy..

keystone

toofy wrote: »

Thanks for the reply...to be honest I'm not really sure, the plumbers had a guage they put to the kitchen tap, the same as the Water Service guy ..they both said it was showing 9 or 10 litres.

So thats the flow rate not the pressure. I expect that on discovering the flow rate was perhaps lower than expected that they went out to open up the company stopcock as far as poss and finding it seized changed it for a new one.

My first plumber thought that, as it was an old house the pipes feeding the main could be lead & therefore not fit for the purpose. He did not give me any insight to any solution other than to rip up the floor and refit new pipes, (at a much greater expense.)

If they are lead then he was probably right. There is no other solution.

Now with the Water Service saying the mains pressure is acceptable I am thinking it's a problem with the pipes running from the kitchen to the bathroom above. As soon as I turn on one tap on the bath, and then the other the flow dies.

Please don't confuse pressure and flow rate they are not the same. Earlier in your post you said they tested the flow rate but nothing about the pressure. If they are lead yes you are probably correct.

The house is vacant at the moment as we are working on it for my son, but I'm reticent to go any further until we get this sorted as I don't want to have to rip up tiling or floors to fix the problem.

You may have to if lead and the sensible thing to do is to do it now whilst the place is empty but bypass the lead and finding an alternative route causing the least disruption. I rather get the impression that your disenchantment with plumber #1 is due to him giving you an answer that you didn't want to hear rather than him being unable to affer a "no additional cost" solution.

The second set of plumbers (they came together), took away the gas valve thing beside the stopcock under the kitchen sink and walked away from it saying it was a Water Service problem (I really did not have any faith in them anyhow)

I'm starting to see this as a distraction but it still can't have been a gas valve. LoL. Unless we can establish what it was they took out then there is no further point in pursuing this line of discussion.

the shower I have purchased to fit is a Triton Fast-Fit 9.5kw.. ( it didn't need to be anything special as it would be students in the house)

Does the combi boiler have its own mains cold feed newly fited in copper or plastic? If so you might consider taking the feed for the new shower directly off that. Does the boiler misbehave when you open a cold tap elsewhere in the house?

have I wasted my time/money?

No not necessarily.

Is there anything can be done to sort this problem?

First could we establish what the flow rates and pressures are as per my previous post please? Both hot and cold please.

Cheers

keystone

toofy wrote: »

The original plumber (No.1) has already put the pipes in place for the electric shower, and installed the bath, sink and toilet as we had ripped the old ones out.. but left saying he couldn't get the pressure sorted..so I'm not particularly happy..

Yes - take your point but if you have new pipes in the bathroom having ripped the old ones out (did you do it or did he?) then it should not be necessary to tear up the bathroom floor or the tiles because that pipework has already been replaced. If there is lead present then he must be able to say so because he would have had to connect to it somewhere.

If you prevented him from carrying out additional work which he said was necessary to sort the flow rate (pressure) out albeit at additional cost then I don't see how you can be unhappy that he left without sorting the flow rate (pressure??) out. Just telling it how I see it.

I still think you are meaning flow rate not pressure so it would be useful to get those readings requested to determine which it is?

Cheers

toofy

All the pipes I could see visible upstairs are copper and/ or pvc? we had to replace the joists in the floor, so I know there isn't lead throughout the house, (apart from a redundant concrete tank in the roofspace with old lead pipes from it.)
It is underground that the plumber No.1 thinks there are lead pipes running from the mains on the street to the kitchen tap, the house is an old Victorian terraced house that was local housing authority stock before it was purchased.
The Water Service valve is directly outside the front door, so I assume we would have to track the concrete floor through the hall, living room and then onto the kitchen; if this was done would it correct the problem? And yes the boiler seems to cut out if I turn the kitchen tap on downstairs..having never had a combi boiler before I didn't know if this should happen..

toofy

And yes Plumbers No.2 explained this was a gas valve - (it was a small plastic valve with a ball inside it that restricted flow..so they took it out and extended the pipe from the mains to the stopcock..

keystone

OK so the lead is in horizontal run from the company stopcock to the internal stopcock and all other internal pipework has been replaced (save the stuff remaining i the rof with the redundant cold water tank). The kitchen tap is fine when operated on its own so that suggests the pressure/flow rate into the property is fine with a single drawoff open. So sorry to harp on about it what is the pressure within the property at the nearest point to the internal stopcock (washing machine tap is often the simplest point to test it as already mentioned)

And sorry but once again what are the flow rates in the bathroom both hot and cold firstly when the kitchen tap is open and secondly when its closed?

I don't particularly expect you to rush around measuring these at this time of night especially as its not critical wiuth an empty house so suggest that its time to go to the old rack and revisit it tomorow.

Cheers

keystone

Ok then lets just accept it was a ball valve of some description that may (or may not) have been contributing to the problem and leave it at that because irrespective of whatever they called it it can't have been a gas valve.

Cheers

toofy

By the way I hadn't dismissed plumber No.1,.. I had to bring in an electrician to run a wire from the fusebox through to the bathroom to connect the shower (hence the delay in getting him back)..I have no problem asking him back to track the floor from the mains to the kitchen if this is the correct thing to do..I just want it sorted, (that's why I asked for a second opinion from the other plumbers) so I can get on with other things..