interview under caution, what next??

ebbiezak

Hi, new to all this so here goes, as i really need some advice. In november i received a letter from dwp to attend an interview under caution, i panicked as didnt know what i had done wrong, I had started a job but declared everything, well this was to do with some temp work i did in may-july. i was on income support and was asked to do approx 12 hours a week, first thing I did was to phone my local benefits and tell them, they gave me a mumber to ring in birmingham which i rang start after, explained every thing to them. they said thats fine income support will change accordingly just send us the pay slips please, so i asked for the address etc,so i sent my pay slips off, well two i totally forgot to send the last one due to kids breaking up from school (no excuse i know) when i was in the interview i explained what i had done etc and they actually had noted my telephone conversation about pay, hours etc! but guess what NO PAY SLIPS, so to them i had received what i wasnt entiled to all my fault their word agaisnt mine!! i thought i was receiving what i was entiled to, I followed the correct procedure but have an over payment of approx £400. the man who interviewed me said that he would go back to his boss with my tape and everything and he would decide what they would do next, weather or not it would go to court as i was not giving in to it being my fault! he even said they would look in another department incase my wage slips went to the wrong department???? this was 13 weeks ago and i'm still panicking about it all now, i'm so scared i will have to go to court? anyone else been in this situation?

Mara69

I doubt very much you'll have to go to court. From what I can gather you did send in the payslips but continued to get the same amount of money as they failed to received them. You didn't chase it up and therefore have an overpayment that you'll have to pay. Stop fretting and phone them - at least you'll know one way or the other.

want-it-all

Hi

I’m not a legal expert (it might be an idea to take some legal advice), but just from my understanding of these matters, court would be unlikely for an overpayment of £400. If the situation is as you say it is – i.e. you did inform, but it’s now a case of he said, she said – and if it’s your first ‘benefit offence’, prosecution would be unlikely for this amount and under these circumstances.

The DWP have a policy of generally prosecuting cases of ‘fraud’ involving overpayments in excess of £2,000, unless certain aggravating factors exist, i.e. you have been cautioned and/or prosecuted before, specifically for a benefit or fraud offence.

Even in cases where the overpayment exceeds £2,000, the DWP must have a sufficient level of evidence upon which a criminal conviction could be obtained (though being found not guilty would always be a possibility). They cannot take you to court on a whim, and it is an expensive, complex, and sometimes time-consuming process.


There are alternatives to prosecution, and the outcomes would be as follows, in order of ‘severity’:

1) No further action


2) An Administrative Penalty, whereby you are effectively ‘fined’ 30% of your overpayment, so around £130, on top of the original £400. This is not a criminal matter and does not form part of a criminal record. An AdPen can be applied whether you have admitted guilt or not


3) A formal caution, whereby court action is averted. Again, this is not a criminal matter and does not become attached to you for the purposes of criminal records, but the caution may be cited in court if you were to find yourself prosecuted for a further benefit offence. In order to receive a caution, you must normally have admitted ‘guilt’, for example you normally need to have confessed before, during or after your IUC, either verbally or in writing.



4) Prosecution, remembering that merely being prosecuted does not mean you will have the book thrown at you. You would have the opportunity to defend your case, ideally with the assistance of a good solicitor. You could be found not guilty, yet if found guilty, there are again a range of punishments. For £400, ‘harsh’ punishments, like prison and so on, are as good as an impossibility (again, depending on the exact factors of the case in question).

In order for an AdPen or Caution to be offered, the DWP must still have a certain standard of evidence that you have deliberately committed benefit fraud. Always take legal advice if an AdPen or Caution is offered. You can refuse to accept either, but you can be prosecuted instead if you refuse.

So, there’s your range of scenarios, from best to worst.

However, as stated, for the amount involved and the circumstances surrounding it, it would appear as though prosecution would be unlikely. Why not consult with a solicitor? You can usually consult free of charge on an initial appointment basis, and are likely to be left with a good idea of the possible outcome.

What is likely, though, is that you’ll have to repay the overpayment. However, payment plans can be implemented, and just having an overpayment doesn’t mean you’re guilty of a crime, or that you’d be prosecuted for it.

rogerblack

Firstly, I would recommend getting a complete copy of your IS file, and any recordings that may be made of telephone conversations.
http://www.dwp.gov.uk/privacy-policy/data-protection/

Do you still have phonebills, and can you find the relevant phone call on them?
This is additional evidence. Did anyone know that you did this, and can perhaps confirm that you posted it?
I assume you diddn't post them registered?

If the overpayment is due to official error, it cannot be collected.
Getting them to accept it's due to official error is another thing of course.

ebbiezak

Just to let people know the outcome. Received letter saying it was fault as I still received the money into my account! A computer logged phone call was found of me declaring my working hours and employer etc.But it all came down to me, who should of known how much benefit I should of been receiving ( no revised letter was sent out to me) I just assumed that was the correct amount and they had received my payslips (which they promised me they had searched all local offices because sometimes they end up at the wrong one!!!!) so it was my job to do theirs! So people please phone and get every detail, request it in writing, jot down times, dates, people who you've spoke to! If I would of had the strength in me I would of appealed but this has caused me to have manic depression and anxioty attacks and to top it off just received another letter for hb/ct benefit fraud!!!

Pricivius

Your original post states you only sent two out of three payslips when you had been asked to send them all so it does not surprise me that you were found to be at fault, to be honest, as you failed to provide all the information you were asked to send.

With this in mind, I'm not sure there would have been strong grounds to appeal.

benefitbaby

Pricivius wrote: »

Your original post states you only sent two out of three payslips when you had been asked to send them all so it does not surprise me that you were found to be at fault, to be honest, as you failed to provide all the information you were asked to send.

With this in mind, I'm not sure there would have been strong grounds to appeal.

I disagree, the DWP were in receipt of information that the OP was working, who the employer was and the relevant hours and dates therefore the OP did not fail to disclose any material fact.

The DWP had all relevant information and could easily have requested the evidence of pay from either the OP or employer but they did not and as a result IS was overpaid.

If this was my case I would appeal and argue that the overpayment is non-recoverable.