Greece...

gailey_2

Graham_Devon wrote: »

One thing.

Greek people are up in arms about this. They too, as far as the interviews I have heard, do not want more bailouts and imposed hardship. Now I can't speak on behalf of them all, but this is what I hear on programmes such as newsnight when Greek people are interviewed. It's what i see on blogs.

The Greek people, have, supposedly got an election in April. I say supposedly as I wouldn't be at all surprised if Germany forced that not to happen.

What happens if the Greek people vote in a new government and the government don't continue down this path?

From what I saw last night on newsnight think will be legally binding no matter what goverenment and unsure if goverenment will have direct access to money its more like europe giving them pocket money and permant monitors within the country as they cant be trusted.

what shocked me about newsnight peice wa sa lot including me thourght their debts were bad due to overspending when its got worse because of goldman sachesdoing dody deal and making their debts worse.

Alkthough I think in some cases austerity is way to go.
what the greeks have had
what they were planning
yet further they need to go

baffled under those conditions when debt to gdp so high how the greeks will see growth return even after 5years they may still be the ****. I worry country going into civil war if democracy fails and eurozone dont like democracy they prefer techno crat governments. The greek elections be very interesting.
I thourght polls suggested greeks want to remain in eu but baffled why?

CLAPTON

Plater wrote: »

All the main currencies of the world. The USA is winning by debasing the most, but China has them by the balls. The UK is abusing the pouind a great deal but the printing will get more as the crisis worsens.

The Japanese are trying to create trillions of Yen at the same speed as the rest of the world but are losing. They need to get faster printing presses. Or just dont bother printing it, just type it into bank accounts and spend it that way.

I don't accept your analysis

certainly China are holding their currency down and trying to link to the dollar

Japan and the Swiss is struggling to hold down their currency because of the flight to 'good' currencies in uncertain times

UK and US are sinking because they have a balance of payment deficit and low interest rates and QE rather than specific policies to devalue

others, I'm not sure about.

AndyGuil

Graham_Devon wrote: »

One thing.

Greek people are up in arms about this. They too, as far as the interviews I have heard, do not want more bailouts and imposed hardship. Now I can't speak on behalf of them all, but this is what I hear on programmes such as newsnight when Greek people are interviewed. It's what i see on blogs.

The Greek people, have, supposedly got an election in April. I say supposedly as I wouldn't be at all surprised if Germany forced that not to happen.

What happens if the Greek people vote in a new government and the government don't continue down this path?

Any party that says it will stop paying the debt will win. Germany won't be able to stop elections, that would be illegal and unethical.

lvader

AndyGuil wrote: »

Any party that says it will stop paying the debt will win. Germany won't be able to stop elections, that would be illegal and unethical.

They would still need to leave the Euro which wouldn't be a popular move. I don't see elections changing anything.

AndyGuil

lvader wrote: »

They would still need to leave the Euro which wouldn't be a popular move. I don't see elections changing anything.

They will because they can't pay back the debt. They need their own currency to be competitive. Put simply to them; stay indebted, in recession, low job numbers and with the Eurozone (especially Germany) meddling with the country, or debtless, no euro, will move out of recession, more jobs, competitive and no countries meddling in its affairs.

lvader

AndyGuil wrote: »

They will because they can't pay back the debt. They need their own currency to be competitive. Put simply to them; stay indebted, in recession, low job numbers and with the Eurozone (especially Germany) meddling with the country, or debtless, no euro, will move out of recession, more jobs, competitive and no countries meddling in its affairs.

They don't have to pay the debt back, they just need to show they can pay the interest. I still don't think any party will decide to leave the Euro and polls have shown that the Greek people don't want to either.

AndyGuil

lvader wrote: »

They don't have to pay the debt back, they just need to show they can pay the interest. I still don't think any party will decide to leave the Euro and polls have shown that the Greek people don't want to either.

They can't pay the interest. The debt is too high, that is why they need the bailout.

A._Badger

AndyGuil wrote: »

Any party that says it will stop paying the debt will win. Germany won't be able to stop elections, that would be illegal and unethical.

And there's no precedent for that is there?

lvader

AndyGuil wrote: »

They can't pay the interest. The debt is too high, that is why they need the bailout.

They can't at the moment but it's not a huge stretch to think that they may get there, that is why they are being bailed out.

pineapple

lvader wrote: »

They can't at the moment but it's not a huge stretch to think that they may get there, that is why they are being bailed out.

It's a very huge stretch indeed. Bailing Greece out is more about protecting the Eurozone and buying time to organise firewalls pending the inevitable default. Plus when the new cuts bite and the realisation sinks home that the technocrats have effectively taken over in Athens, how do you think the people will react?
AG in post 187 nailed it. It's the only way out.