Devil's Advocate

The_Slithy_Tove

There are a number of car parks out there, both council and private, where the charging structure goes something like:

• Up to 1 hour: free
• 1-2 hours: £1
• 2-4 hours: £2

and so on. A council car park I was in the other day had such a structure to encourage shoppers (on-street parking is also free for an hour, if you can find a space), but discourage people parking there all day. And some private airport car parks allow 10 or 20 minutes free, but it quickly ramps up after that, getting very expensive indeeed after a few hours, to encourage you to use the long stay car park.

So, there is a precedent for free parking, but charging after a certain period. Extending this to an extreme, PPCs apply the same model to their car parks (only it's 2 or 3 hours free, £50-£100 thereafter). Some of the more cleverly signed car parks talk about FREE Parking and a £60 charge thereafter (so, it's all part of the parking charge structure, not a penalty).

Where is the line, therefore, between my initial example and what the PPCs do in many of their car parks? Just because it's free for an hour, and there's a charge thereafter, one can't say their losses are zero if you park for 3 hours. Maybe if they provided a machine where you could pay your £50 for parking for more than a couple of hours, they could get away with it.

Discuss...

P.S. I'm deliberately ignoring the have-you-entered-into-a-contract-by-reading-(or-not)-the-signs side of this. Let's stick to what they can charge for what assuming there's a contract of sorts.

Trebor16

Isn't that the way Perky works?

bargepole

The_Slithy_Tove wrote: »

... Maybe if they provided a machine where you could pay your £50 for parking for more than a couple of hours, they could get away with it. ...

I think that's the key factor here, most of these PPC [STRIKE]penalties[/STRIKE] contractual charges don't actually have any means of taking payment.

It can therefore be argued (and has been, in court) that the £50 or whatever, although it may be advertised on the signs as a contractual charge, is actually there as a deterrent to stop people from parking, and is in reality a penalty.

This is particularly so when it's private land for permit-holders only - there is no invitation for others to park, and the charge is clearly there to penalise (unlawfully) people who do.

TrickyWicky

I actually find some PPC signage is easier to understand than the highway codes explanation of parking rules. The last time I read the section about waiting, loading, and all the similar tosh, it was about as clear as mud and I'd be surprised if it got the crystal mark for clear english. It's only because I've been a CEO / PA for two authorities that I understand it clearly.

PPC signs whilst yes they can cause confusion, are usually easier to understand as long as you read them properly not just a quick glimpse. Most PPCs are incapable of making complex sentences that confuse people like government departments.

karen_4444

Hi, I recently drove into a local small shopping area car park in the west Midlands as i was feeling faint and had excruciating stomach pains. I drove into a parking space, and went out of the car to find a toilet. My friend remained in the car for the 29 mins I was in the parking space. I have since received a parking charge notice for £60 from EXCEL PARKING to be paid in 14 days, and will go up to £100 if not paid within that time scale! Any advise from anyone please? Should I ignore, or write in explaining i was in pain and could not drive as Martin Lewis advises?? Please help as I am very worried about this but feel it is unjust as my car was not left at any time. Thank you.

taffy056

Karen you are to ignore excel they will not take you to court, all you will get is junk mail through the post which you can ignore.

Can I suggest though to post your question in a new thread instead of this one, it may be missed and you get a better response by asking in your own thread instead of asking in a Pre existing one - thanks

AlexisV

The pricing structure you describe is a veiled attempt to prevent the charge appearing to amount to a contractual penalty. The sum clearly indicates the intention is to disallow parking after a certain period.

Read Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd v New Garage & Motor Co [1915] and use the 'contractual penalty test' to determine whether the pricing structure would meet the criteria.

karen_4444

taffy056 wrote: »

Karen you are to ignore excel they will not take you to court, all you will get is junk mail through the post which you can ignore.

Can I suggest though to post your question in a new thread instead of this one, it may be missed and you get a better response by asking in your own thread instead of asking in a Pre existing one - thanks

Thank you for your reply and advice................i am however not sure how to open a new thread as i am new to this website....can you advise me please? Thanks again. Karen.

taffy056

karen_4444 wrote: »

Thank you for your reply and advice................i am however not sure how to open a new thread as i am new to this website....can you advise me please? Thanks again. Karen.

Try this, go to the link below

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=163

On the top left hand corner of the forum you will see a a button called 'New Thread' and you can just post away hope it helps

Coupon-mad

Go here, to the forum index of all current threads.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=163

Firstly PLEASE READ the sticky thread at the top, that's what it's there for, that's what the Watchdog clip is linked there for. Tells you pretty much everything you need to know.

If you are still unsure then click on 'new thread' (blue button top left above the index list). But please read the top sticky thread first 'PPC letters & threats'.

taffy056

Beat you to it Coupon