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Charge back for service partly not provided..help

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Hi,

I was eligible for a warmfront grant to put a new boiler in the house. However there was not enough money in the grant to cover the works so they asked me for a £500 contribution. The total cost of works was approx £2000. My son paid the £500 on his credit card to warmfront. Warmfront then sent their own approved installer to carry out the work. However, when it came to do the work, the installer did not comply with the schedule of works and missed out vital work that should have been done before the boiler was installed. Basically he was skipping out on the work that could not be seen to save himself time and money, even though he got the full £2000 from me and the grant. This means the boiler warranty is void as it was not installed according to manufacurer instructions and if it breaks down I'll be high and dry thanks to this guys negligence.

My son has contacted the credit card co, to dispute the £500 stating he did not receive the service.

What I am wondering is if we can do a charge back on this amount, as it was a partial amount. Will the credit card co say that you need to sue in court from the grant (£1500) funds etc or put up any hurdles.

Where do I stand and what is the best way to proceed?

Comments

  • What do warmfront say about the workmanship?
    2014 Target;
    To overpay CC by £1,000.
    Overpayment to date : £310

    2nd Purse Challenge:
    £15.88 saved to date
  • meer53
    meer53 Posts: 10,217 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary 10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Saeed wrote: »
    Hi,

    I was eligible for a warmfront grant to put a new boiler in the house. However there was not enough money in the grant to cover the works so they asked me for a £500 contribution. The total cost of works was approx £2000. My son paid the £500 on his credit card to warmfront. Warmfront then sent their own approved installer to carry out the work. However, when it came to do the work, the installer did not comply with the schedule of works and missed out vital work that should have been done before the boiler was installed. Basically he was skipping out on the work that could not be seen to save himself time and money, even though he got the full £2000 from me and the grant. This means the boiler warranty is void as it was not installed according to manufacurer instructions and if it breaks down I'll be high and dry thanks to this guys negligence.

    My son has contacted the credit card co, to dispute the £500 stating he did not receive the service.

    What I am wondering is if we can do a charge back on this amount, as it was a partial amount. Will the credit card co say that you need to sue in court from the grant (£1500) funds etc or put up any hurdles.

    Where do I stand and what is the best way to proceed?

    Your son paid on his credit card so you will probably struggle with any chargeback as the service was provided for you and not him. There is no debtor/creditor relationship. Your son needs to discuss this with his CC issuer.
  • There are some major scams going on with these warmfront grants, I know someone who qualified for one a couple of years ago, the live rurally so needed a replacement oil fired boiler, they qualified for a 5k grant to replace the boiler, hot water tanks and oil tank, the company still wanted an added contribution of about £300 even though they had a 5k grant! After ringing round a few local engineers they could have had the exact same thing fitted privately for a shade over 3k! Someone somewhere (I suspect the government) is being seriously ripped off with these grants!

    Anyhoo as has already been suggested what do Warmfront have to say? They are ultimately responsible for the install........

    HTH
    "You can measure a man's character by the choices he makes under pressure"
    Sir Winston Churchill
  • Saeed
    Saeed Posts: 733 Forumite
    What do warmfront say about the workmanship?
    warmfront haven't been out to inspect the work and have asked me to contact the installers first. I've written a letter to the installers so lets see what happens. They only thing is that they areas where they have not done the work is the things that cannot be seen, for example not putting in cleaner into the system and cleaning it out before fitting new boiler etc..
    Your son paid on his credit card so you will probably struggle with any chargeback as the service was provided for you and not him. There is no debtor/creditor relationship. Your son needs to discuss this with his CC issuer.

    That's what I feared. He has disputed it and they are sending him the paperwork to fill in
  • *LolaB*
    *LolaB* Posts: 51 Forumite
    meer53 wrote: »
    Your son paid on his credit card so you will probably struggle with any chargeback as the service was provided for you and not him. There is no debtor/creditor relationship. Your son needs to discuss this with his CC issuer.

    Not technically correct, there is no debtor/creditor relationship required for a chargeback. That is specific to a claim under Section 75.
  • bris
    bris Posts: 10,548 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    What made you think it needed cleaner put in? If that is an example of one of your excuses you've got no chance of winning any claim. S75 will not just give a refund, they will investigate it first, if the system is up and running properly then you don't have a claim, you will also have a cert with the system to say it's safe. You got the new boiler, are you qualified to say the work wasn't done properly?
  • Saeed
    Saeed Posts: 733 Forumite
    bris wrote: »
    What made you think it needed cleaner put in? If that is an example of one of your excuses you've got no chance of winning any claim. S75 will not just give a refund, they will investigate it first, if the system is up and running properly then you don't have a claim, you will also have a cert with the system to say it's safe. You got the new boiler, are you qualified to say the work wasn't done properly?

    when a boiler is changed on an existing system a cleaner should always be used. It says so in the boiler installation manual. I am not qualified in boiler installation but the agreement specified that it would be cleaned. The boiler manual also says that it must be cold and hot flushed. this was not done either. System was drained once only and that was before the new boiler was put in place. So the manufacturers installation guidance has been ignored so manufacturer is well within their rights to refuse to repair under the 2 year guarantee. It says that in the manual too.
  • Saeed, did you have an option as to who fitted the boiler or was he forced on you by Warmfront?
    I was registered with Warmfront when the £300 rebate was running and the customer had the option to pick whoever he/she liked. The larger grants were specific to companies that had "bid" to win a place on their list. Usually the companies who got these contracts were bigger companys. Only thing was these companys were sub contracting, contracted work out which if I'm not mistaken was against the rules.
    I've read through your posts and unless I've misunderstood, nothing has gone wrong with your boiler yet so there isn't a warranty claim to worry about just yet.
    When a new boiler is fitted the central heating system is drained down, not thoroughly I agree, now unless you had a powerflush just putting cleaner in wouldn't remove all the sludge and debris from the system anyway. Chemical cleaners come in a few different grades, from very strong to just general cleaners. The very strong ones, F5, X800 (these are usually used during a powerflush, but can be used as they are), would have to be left in for longer than a couple of hours anyway or they'd really not do much at all.
    Someone may disagree with me but the only time the manufacturer would notice that the boiler wasn't flushed correctly would be if the plate heat exchanger was blocked, a thermistor wasn't operating due to magnetite build up on its probe, the main heat exchanger was over heating due to blockage or maybe a pump failure.
    My gf's boiler had warranty claims 4 times on its plate heat exchanger due to sludge (I didn't fit this boiler) and not once did the manufacturer refuse to change the part or void the warranty even after I begged the service engineer to void it due to the installing engineers "fit it and run attitude"

    If Warmfront put him forward then make them get him back. If you chose him, then let him know that you're contacting Trading Standards.
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