recieved a tax underpaid letter today.

antonic

Because this is the first time they have been able to contact you regarding this debt which is now nearly 5 years old.

As dori2o has advised set up a repayment plan and stick to it, also keep HMRC informed if you move again !.

dori2o wrote: »

HMRC has 4 years from the end of the tax year in order to collect underpayments via a tax code adjustment.

I would check with HMRC to ensure the underpayment IS going to be collected via your tax code in 12/13.

I'm certain the information I have is correct, and I'll check again when I get in work tomorrow afternoon.

If they cannot collect via your tax code you do have the option to agree a payment plan and pay a monthly amount via Direct Debit. So long as the agreement is in place before 05/04/12 then this satisfies the 4 year rule.

chrismac1

You have got to Esc A19 this one. Even if you lose, HMRC move at a snail's pace so it will give you up to an extra 12 months' breathing space if you play your cards right. Whatever their silly rules say, they had all the information they needed to give you this tax bill in May 2008 unless one or other employer failed to do their end of year returns correctly. If you search for Esc A19 cases on here you'll find that finger pointing exercises between HMRC and employers are commonplace. In my opinion - prepare for howls of anguish from HMRC posters and personal criticisms towards me - 80% plus of these cases are HMRC's blunder and not the employer's. Note that HMRC fine employer's £400 or more for getting the end of year returns in late or wrong, that's one reason why it's likely to be HMRC's muck-up here.

Lots of people have won Esc A19 cases, myself included for clients. Be prepared to go all twelve rounds, they tend to fob you off completely in the early letters, and in my opinion it's only when you've written about 3 times that anyone actually bothers to read your letter properly. Until you get a reply which mentions things specific to your case - such as specific amounts or employer details - you can assume no one has bothered, just sent the standard "fob off" response. Make sure you put those specifics into every letter you send. Good luck!

dori2o

chrismac1 wrote: »

You have got to Esc A19 this one. Even if you lose, HMRC move at a snail's pace so it will give you up to an extra 12 months' breathing space if you play your cards right. Whatever their silly rules say, they had all the information they needed to give you this tax bill in May 2008 unless one or other employer failed to do their end of year returns correctly. If you search for Esc A19 cases on here you'll find that finger pointing exercises between HMRC and employers are commonplace. In my opinion - prepare for howls of anguish from HMRC posters and personal criticisms towards me - 80% plus of these cases are HMRC's blunder and not the employer's. Note that HMRC fine employer's £400 or more for getting the end of year returns in late or wrong, that's one reason why it's likely to be HMRC's muck-up here.

Lots of people have won Esc A19 cases, myself included for clients. Be prepared to go all twelve rounds, they tend to fob you off completely in the early letters, and in my opinion it's only when you've written about 3 times that anyone actually bothers to read your letter properly. Until you get a reply which mentions things specific to your case - such as specific amounts or employer details - you can assume no one has bothered, just sent the standard "fob off" response. Make sure you put those specifics into every letter you send. Good luck!

Yet again another completely pointless post bu Chrismac with the usual false truths.

The time limits in ESCA19 refer to information HMRC should have used in order to collect the correct amount of tax at the time the tax was due.

Hmrc have as much right as the ordinary person, (more in the case of serious fraud) to review cases for earlier years. As it currently stands and until 31/01/2012 anyone can ask for a review of all years going back to 2005-2006. Until 31/03/2012 you can request a review of all years going back to 2006-2007 and until 05/04/2012 you can review all years going back to 2007-2008. From then on you can review any 4 years period following the end of the tax year.

Without seeing the actual figures we are all just guessing, BUT if it is the case that the 2nd employer of the year did not operate the P45 details and operated the payrol as though this was the first employment of the year there is absolutely nothing that HMRC could have done to prevent the underpayment.

Secondly, your case about getting 12 months breathing space is not correct either.

Making a claim under ESCA19 does not prevent HMRC from continuing to try and collect this underpayment. If the underpayment continues to go unpaid the HMRC will simply transfer the 'debt' to Self Assessment and issue a 2007-2008 self assessment form. This gives HMRC the opportunity to charge penalties and interest and gives them greater powers of recovery. It also renders ESCA19 redundant as it only applies to PAYE assessments.

It's probably correct to say I have seen far more of these assessments than you have, and it is also correct to say that yes, there have been mistakes made by HMRC. However, the vast majority of these underpayments are either down to people having more than 1 job with the emergency code in operation at all sources, or as above when somebody has changed employer and the P45 details have not been brought forwards but a cumulative code has been used at the 2nd employer, or most commonly, the individual has received an employer benefit that wasn't notified to HMRC at the point of receipt and therefore the tax code has not been adjusted to allow for the tax due on the benefit to be charged throughout the year.

You can continue your little tirade against HMRC all you want. To be honest the people on here seem to have marked your card for what you really are. The advice you have given in the past is so bad, your opinion now counts for nothing.

chrismac1

"prepare for howls of anguish from HMRC posters and personal criticisms towards me"

As expected. I must just be very lucky despite my incompetence as I have a 100% record against HMRC in Tribunals, complaint cases and Esc A19.

Mooperman

ok well this has just confused matters.

So what youre saying Dori2o is that HMRC have asked me to do a self assesment so they can enforce the collection from me sooner.

i cant help but feel this is all really unfair.

1. ive been in the same job for 11 years now and all changes have been done behind the scenes by my employer (the NHS).

2. HMRC get in touch about a 4 yr old tax debt - why wasnt this picked up on sooner, shouldnt tax be checked yearly???

3. Now i feel like i'm being stomped all over because of either a mistake by the tax office or my employer??


what a massive pile of !!!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

Rupert_Bear

HMRC sent me tax calculation advising I had underpaid by over £200 4 years ago. However I could prove this amount was paid and requested they checked again. They did and they found the £200 missing payment and it out turned out they owed me £112.00. Never take their word for anything.

jennifernil

Mooperman wrote: »

ok well this has just confused matters.

So what youre saying Dori2o is that HMRC have asked me to do a self assesment so they can enforce the collection from me sooner.

i cant help but feel this is all really unfair.

1. ive been in the same job for 11 years now and all changes have been done behind the scenes by my employer (the NHS).

2. HMRC get in touch about a 4 yr old tax debt - why wasnt this picked up on sooner, shouldnt tax be checked yearly???

3. Now i feel like i'm being stomped all over because of either a mistake by the tax office or my employer??


what a massive pile of !!!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

It is actually YOUR resposibility to ensure your tax is in order, so a good idea to find out a bit about how tax works. For most of us, our tax is very straightforward, so it is not difficult to understand.

When you get the figures, you should check that the amount due is correct, come back if you need help.

If it is correct then it has to be paid. The thing to remember in that case is that you have had more money than you should have had, you are not being asked to pay something that is not due.

Mikeyorks

Rupert_Bear wrote: »

HMRC sent me tax calculation advising I had underpaid by over £200 4 years ago. However I could prove this amount was paid and requested they checked again. They did and they found the £200 missing payment and it out turned out they owed me £112.00. Never take their word for anything.

Not really helpful to the OP. From memory you had paid the £200 as a Voluntary Direct Payment and it was sitting in a suspense account? Not remotely aligning with the OPs circumstances?

Mooperman

jennifernil wrote: »

It is actually YOUR resposibility to ensure your tax is in order, so a good idea to find out a bit about how tax works. For most of us, our tax is very straightforward, so it is not difficult to understand.

perhaps worded a little harshly, as someone who has always paid tax via PAYE i'm sure i'm not in the minority of people who assumes that this is in order since its not like i'm asked what tax i want/should be paying is it!? Its all done before i get my wages.

That being said, ive noted your other comments so thankyou. If it is a case of i do owe the money then thats that, i'll arrange a DD with the tax office and pay it off quickly and easily but not until i get all the facts/figures.

damonsalvatore wrote: »

If you really have underpaid tax then it the time to pay the tax and if it is the mistake of the income tax department then just let them know about it.

If i really have underpaid the tax then A: i certainly didnt do it intentionally, i wouldve been much happier to have it out of my wages from the offset and B: since i only got the letter yesterday morning its a bit early for the "time to pay" comments thank you.

jennifernil

Mooperman wrote: »

perhaps worded a little harshly, as someone who has always paid tax via PAYE i'm sure i'm not in the minority of people who assumes that this is in order since its not like i'm asked what tax i want/should be paying is it!? Its all done before i get my wages.

That being said, ive noted your other comments so thankyou. If it is a case of i do owe the money then thats that, i'll arrange a DD with the tax office and pay it off quickly and easily but not until i get all the facts/figures.



If i really have underpaid the tax then A: i certainly didnt do it intentionally, i wouldve been much happier to have it out of my wages from the offset and B: since i only got the letter yesterday morning its a bit early for the "time to pay" comments thank you.

Not intended to be harsh, just stating what the actual rules are.

Even on PAYE you should take an interest for your own sake. I think I heard there were far more people overpaid on their tax than underpaid, so it's good to find out how it works and check up on your situation.