Halifax overdraft fee and "end of day"

Derivative

When is the "end of day" as defined for the purposes of Halifax charging a £1 daily fee on some accounts when an arranged overdraft is used?

YorkshireBoy

http://www.halifax.co.uk/bankaccounts/pdf/reward-current-account-guide.pdf (Part B, condition 4.2)

rb10

Unusually, I do not think that you are correct here YorkshireBoy.

The condition that you refer to gives a definition of 'working day'.

However, the conditions that allow Halifax to charge you a daily overdraft fee (8.6 & 8.9) do not use this phrase. Instead, they say 'at the end of any day'.

Since 'day' is not defined anywhere in the conditions, we use the standard definition of this word - i.e. you have until midnight to bring your account back into credit to avoid being charged.

YorkshireBoy

rb10 wrote: »

Unusually, I do not think that you are correct here YorkshireBoy.

The condition that you refer to gives a definition of 'working day'.

However, the conditions that allow Halifax to charge you a daily overdraft fee (8.6 & 8.9) do not use this phrase. Instead, they say 'at the end of any day'.

Since 'day' is not defined anywhere in the conditions, we use the standard definition of this word - i.e. you have until midnight to bring your account back into credit to avoid being charged.

I see your point, but condition 4.1 covers the inbound payment which prevents a fee being payable...and that has to be received by the end of the "working day" (as you won't be able to deposit after this time, you won't be able to avoid the fee if the "working day" for inbound electronic payments ends at, say, 10.30pm).

Halifax say this will not normally be before 3.30pm in branch (presumably the word "normally" allows them to close branches early on Xmas Eve for example?), but say the cut-off times differ for telephone and internet banking.

They do close off condition 4.2 by saying "You can ask us for further information about the relevant cut-off times", so maybe that's what the OP should do...and then feed back the response.

Zorz_2

For reference, last month I did a withdrawal that brought my account balance in overdraft (within the planned OD limit). When I returned home, around 10-11pm (I should have noted the exact hour), I transferred some money via Lloyds ebanking to bring the account back in credit. While the transfer was instant, it was registered as being made the next day.

So the "end of day" is definitely before midnight.

opinions4u

I did much prefer the old world of "same day" which clearly meant up to and including 11.59pm.

My guess (and it's exactly that - the days of knowing it inside out are long gone!) is that the branch systems have their own cut off time (typically 4pm for an IDM machine and 5pm for counter, probably plus a few minutes depending on when staff carry out "end of day" procedures).

I think the online / telephony transactions are dependent on when the overnight processing is done. In Lloyds TSB this is around 10pm. I think Halifax (and BoS) are done after this - so typically between 10.30pm and midnight.

So to be on the safe side, I'd suggest getting everything done before 10pm.

rb10

YorkshireBoy wrote: »

I see your point, but condition 4.1 covers the inbound payment which prevents a fee being payable...and that has to be received by the end of the "working day" (as you won't be able to deposit after this time, you won't be able to avoid the fee if the "working day" for inbound electronic payments ends at, say, 10.30pm).

Halifax say this will not normally be before 3.30pm in branch (presumably the word "normally" allows them to close branches early on Xmas Eve for example?), but say the cut-off times differ for telephone and internet banking.

They do close off condition 4.2 by saying "You can ask us for further information about the relevant cut-off times", so maybe that's what the OP should do...and then feed back the response.

Fair point.

But what about 5.3(a)?

When we receive a payment for your account in
sterling (£), we will show it in your account and (if
applicable) it will earn interest (or reduce interest
you pay) from that day. We will allow you to use it
straightaway.

No mention of cut-off times or working days. Just that it will count from that day.

No idea why they use the term 'interest', but if we take this to mean 'fee', then a faster payment made at 23.59 bringing the account into credit would be sufficient to prevent a fee from being charged.

callum9999

rb10 wrote: »

Fair point.

But what about 5.3(a)?



No mention of cut-off times or working days. Just that it will count from that day.

No idea why they use the term 'interest', but if we take this to mean 'fee', then a faster payment made at 23.59 bringing the account into credit would be sufficient to prevent a fee from being charged.

But didn't someone above do exactly that and still got charged?

Zorz_2

callum9999 wrote: »

But didn't someone above do exactly that and still got charged?

Yes, that was me. And just to confirm, yesterday I got my fiver reward in, and a charge of 1 pound for "PLANNED O/D FEE" in the account.