Automated Competition Entries - Compers Unite!

jdsaint

some people might argue that we ourselves are not genuine compers as such because we use sites like this

You can argue a lot of scenarios over this - genuine customers, genuine interest, etc and my view is you need to draw a line somewhere.

If you're entering the comps yourselves, at least you're making an effort to visit the site. The promoter then has a chance to influence you further with their marketing onsite.

i just wonder whether the times competitions every hour were also affected

I don't think the larger sites target these.

comping is only just now taken over by automated entries. ts not like they just invented this

Good point... the difference now is size. When we were first on the case so to speak it was 100-500 entries, then 4000, then 20,000. To be honest the large volume makes things more noticeable (at least you'd think) so brands/sites should spot the problem. The result should be those entries get disqualified and all should be fine... although obviously not the case.

makes you wonder if there was any point entering in the first place

Remember that we're talking about a percentage of comps each month. Facebook, Twitter, Blog, Login to Enter, Creative type comps are around - plus a number of brands/agencies etc are on the ball against automated entries.

Carry on entering, but know that if you visit XYZ site and it doesn't mention automated entries that your chances may be limited OR better still a quick email from you could give them information they currently don't have.

Jason

luijo

Everything RuthMarianna and others have said about becoming disheartened, is exactly how I feel. I know that we are not guaranteed a win, but when you enjoy at least giving something a go just for that chance you might win something it makes me feel a bit fed up that the odds are now not just 1 in say a couple of thousand to something at least along the lines of 1 in 36000 or above (which must be due in part to automated entries) The recent Sacla contest said in their losers email that they had over 36000 entries...maybe im just out of touch but I wouldn't have thought that it would be so high. It does make me think now everytime I enter something just how many automated entries they are getting too. I also wondered whether anyone on here actually subscribes to these services and what their thoughts are.. It would be good to know whether they think they are getting their moneys worth or not. I don't really think that MSE are the same as those companies though, as we all just enter the once and more often than not actually do visit the sites... I have even signed up and bought things as a result of a comp that has been put on here.

Anyway this is only my opinion, and I don't want to offend anyone.

Good luck all, and thank you to all posters for your brilliant and selfless work.. May 2012 be extra lucky for everyone.

ehlittleone

bcd2009 wrote: »

But what i dont understand is that some of you guys react like comping is only just now taken over by automated entries. Its not like they just invented this Those "services" have been around forever. And the people that know how to cheat the sytem have been there for ever too.

Your odds are not suddenly worse now, it can only improve from now on

I hope noone feels offended, just my 2 cents, have a nice sunday!

I've been doing this for years now and honestly have only just become aware that it was going on.

I know a lot more people are entering competitions these days which reduces the odds but at least they are doing it themselves.

Paying someone else to do it to me seems like cheating - and although I'm sure there's other ways of cheating this seems like one of the times we can actually do something about it to try and get it stopped.

And like you say if companies listen it can only improve the odds and benefit everyone here.



A couple of companies I have always wondered about are

Music News
The Detour and the other one?

I always wondered if their competitions were genuine because I never see anyone say they had won from them so stopped entering them. Maybe this explains why.

jdsaint

The recent Sacla contest said in their losers email that they had over 36000 entries

It did get automated entries... as they're listed on one of them as doing so.

What we don't know is if they disqualified them or knew about them... See http://www.facebook.com/ItalianFoodLovers?sk=wall&filter=12 as we've posted on there.

luijo

Thanks jdsaint, I have added a comment to their facebook also. Thanks for all your hard work too.

dazza12

It's occurred to me after reading some of the comments on here and elsewhere that there are some common factors.

- Some of the automated competition sites are firstly using both the forum and Loquax to find competitions, and then subsequently enter these comps.

- In some cases original competition posters have put a great deal of hard work into finding the comps, and to work out the answers. This has then made it very easy for the automated entry service to adapt their scripts accordingly.

- The people using these services are very lazy indeed.

- Entries from an automated competition entry site are technically an attack on the competition in the form of a denial of service attack - especially if the competition specifically states that these entries are not allowed.

- Some competition organisers have become aware of this thanks to Jason and others and have adapted their rules and methods accordingly.

- Some competition promoters are not only allowing this activity, they're actively encouraging their use by providing the competition entry services with the relevant information. When they then report back to their client, they've promoted their client's service and there were 42000 entries - forgetting the fact that only 2000 of these were genuine and actually saw their client's brand. The client sees this as a success without being aware the promoter cheated.

There are a few ways of preventing some of this. In a lot of cases the automated process will use a particular IP address (like a phone number). With details of these IP addresses or other relevant demographic data from these services (browser id for example or domain it's using) competition providers could be encouraged to block these services. It depends on how comfortable these providers are at sharing such data - as this doesn't contain any personal data as such, it should be ok but it depends on that organisation's policy.

Using this data it could be brought to the MSE IT team's attention. These services are stealing information that is technically the copyright of MSE. Any competitions, or entry details such as answers to questions, although publicly available is only given in good faith by the person who posted it and is intended for individuals to use - not for an organisation to make money from. It would be up to MSE admin to choose what to do regarding this - a block could potentially be put on that particular IP address or range of IPs in order to block access to MSE.

Similar approaches could be taken by other competition sites as appropriate.

These IP details could be provided to competition organisers as appropriate so that they could disregard any entries that are from known cheating sites.

Using the IP address of the automated competition entry site would not breach any data protection regulations as this is not identifiable information for an individual. It would be similar to providing information about a malware ridden site or about a particular virus for instance.

GeeBee38

This is the first time i have heard about it, i wasn't aware this even went on...
I think it is really unfair and should be stopped...
Entering and posting competitions should be fun...

I think automated entries should be classed as cheating and the entries should be disqualified..

It just shows how GREEDY some people are!!!

Sorry, that's my opinion!

jdsaint

These IP details could be provided to competition organisers as appropriate so that they could disregard any entries that are from known cheating sites.

Nice idea... but IPs don't always stay fixed and when one gets blocked, another pops up.

Also the people finding comps have differing IPs to those from automated sources.

We do have a bunch of email accounts that promoters should look out for though. These are easier for promoters to manage as many don't collect IP or know what to look for (e.g. comping marketing dude is not the techie dude).

Jason

dazza12

Although many IP addresses are dynamic, this tends to be mainly with domestic internet accounts.

For the amount of data that is transferred when running an automated service such as these (potentially 200 or so comps entered 10,000 times), this will often exceed the allowance given with many ISP's accounts and therefore a business account would be more appropriate. Also, traffic is 'shaped' on many domestic accounts making such a service run very slowly. The vast majority of business ISP accounts tend to come with a static IP address (or a block of addresses) as standard, and such activity would be acceptable.

One way to confirm this is to compare data provided from web logs - see if any competition promoters would be willing to provide similar data.

However, I do accept that in some cases there will be instances where these services are being run from somebody's spare room on a budget and therefore will get away with it - however once it's made too hard for the bigger entry services, it'll be difficult for the smaller ones to grow.

glacier

If there isn't already one, I think there should be a detailed guide for promoters on how to run comps and make them secure/fair. Then maybe we can point them to the guide. Maybe those who follow it can display a logo or something to show they have.

I know the IPM has a logo/seal they give out (although I've only seen it on a handful of comps). I don't know if that seal covers such things as fairness(?) If it does then maybe that seal can be promoted more.