Can I refuse to work in this cold?

LittleVoice

03022242 wrote: »

doesnt the Health and safety at work act say something like it has to be a minimum of 13 degrees when you walk in and at least 16 degrees one hour later?

Simple answer, "No".

SarEl

LittleVoice wrote: »

Simple answer, "No".

Well actually - it sort of does!

The law only states that the temperature in a workplace should be maintained at a comfortable level as appropriate for the workplace and the level of physical activity. However, the Approved Code of Practice says that the temperature in an indoor workplace should normally be at least 16 degrees unless there is a high level of activity in which case the temperature should be at least 13 degrees. ACP's have the same status as ACAS guidelines - they have the force of law unless the employer can prove that they are not guilty. So in a health and safety case of this sort (and it doesn't need an employee to report the temperture - anyone could prompt an investigation with a phone call), if the temperature is not at least 16 degrees then the court assumes the guilt of the employer in a breach of Health and Safety regulations, unless they can prove that some sudden and immediate drop in temperature occured just as the insepctor entered the building.

Like ACAS guidance, the ACP's set down the expected standards for employers, and are used by the courts as the measure of compliance with the law.

LittleVoice

SarEl wrote: »

Well actually - it sort of does!

The law only states that the temperature in a workplace should be maintained at a comfortable level as appropriate for the workplace and the level of physical activity. However, the Approved Code of Practice says that the temperature in an indoor workplace should normally be at least 16 degrees unless there is a high level of activity in which case the temperature should be at least 13 degrees. ACP's have the same status as ACAS guidelines - they have the force of law unless the employer can prove that they are not guilty. So in a health and safety case of this sort (and it doesn't need an employee to report the temperture - anyone could prompt an investigation with a phone call), if the temperature is not at least 16 degrees then the court assumes the guilt of the employer in a breach of Health and Safety regulations, unless they can prove that some sudden and immediate drop in temperature occured just as the insepctor entered the building.

Like ACAS guidance, the ACP's set down the expected standards for employers, and are used by the courts as the measure of compliance with the law.

Mine was an over simple answer - that is the temperatures aren't specified in the Health and Safety at Work etc Act 1974.

dickydonkin

SarEl wrote: »

10 degrees is damned cold in an office environment and well below the guidelines of a comfortable temperature. If a H&S inspector were to visit an office environment maintained at this tempertaure they would close it until the heating situation had been resolved.

The likelihood of the HSE or Environment Dep closing down a business (or in this case an office) because the temperature is 10 degrees would be extremely remote.

The only scenario such an event would occur would be if there was iminent danger - which in this case there isn't.

The worst that could happen would be an improvement notice served with a reasonable timescale to rectify the matter.

With HSE inspectors also suffering from cutbacks, I suspect that if this was reported, it would be very low down on the scale of priorities - that's assuming a 'visit' would even be considered.

dickydonkin

SarEl wrote: »

Well actually - it sort of does!

The law only states that the temperature in a workplace should be maintained at a comfortable level as appropriate for the workplace and the level of physical activity. However, the Approved Code of Practice says that the temperature in an indoor workplace should normally be at least 16 degrees unless there is a high level of activity in which case the temperature should be at least 13 degrees. ACP's have the same status as ACAS guidelines - they have the force of law unless the employer can prove that they are not guilty. So in a health and safety case of this sort (and it doesn't need an employee to report the temperture - anyone could prompt an investigation with a phone call), if the temperature is not at least 16 degrees then the court assumes the guilt of the employer in a breach of Health and Safety regulations, unless they can prove that some sudden and immediate drop in temperature occured just as the insepctor entered the building.

Like ACAS guidance, the ACP's set down the expected standards for employers, and are used by the courts as the measure of compliance with the law.

All the above is correct of course - but what is missing is the 'get out clause' quoted in the H&SAW Welfare Regulations (and many other H&S regs) is 'So far as is reasonably practicable'.

Mischa8

Similar problem I had in winter 2010/11 when we had the snow in London. The central heating was broken, boiler was broken or worked only occasionally and it was freezing. I collared 2 heaters (1 was a blow air one and the other was an electric one).

In the office I wore thermals, heavier jumpers and Uggs (smart ones) rather than smarter office clothes. I looked smart but certainly not sheer tights and skirts weather (with the snow).

This year the weather has been a lot milder, our boiler and central heating is fixed. I am a bit colder (due to non direct heat from blow heater).

Our main problem is the front door (god knows how it passed H&S regs...), there's a huge gap under it and knowing my boss, it won't get fixed (we were waiting ages until recently to get damp/mould problem sorted out).

So, if I feel cold I'll put on extra heaters (blow ones) and wear my jumpers and Uggs. My colleague who works in the office next to mine knows how cold it can get so it's not as if I'm lying. I don't want to make waves as I value my job!

Uniqlo are doing heat tech long sleeved t-shirts (I think in sale) and leggings and you can get thermal socks too. Like many have said, there is a lower temperature level but doesn't have to be abided by.

donnalou

This reminds me of my first job working in a Jewellers with the door open all day. Even in the snow with no heating on. The owner wouldn't let us close the door because he thought it put off customers!

Savvy_Sue

blossomhill wrote: »

Yes, a good one for office work is to put your feet in a cardbaord box, about the size of a copier paper box - works a treat!

Be VERY careful how you get up: very easy to fall over if you can't move your feet independently!

SarEl wrote: »

Your employers are doing you, their organisation, their clients and their funders no service if they cannot come up with a better solution that "yes, it's cold".

Hear hear ...

Mrs_Arcanum wrote: »

One consideration is the exorbitant cost of trying to heat your office may be ridiculously high compared to actually doing something about keeping the heat in. May be a way of getting something done sooner rather than later.

Indeed: if the charity is paying the heating bills, it's GOT to be cheaper to get this problem sorted sooner rather than later!

Mrs_Arcanum wrote: »

wear one of those giant single slippers.

I repeat my comment about the cardboard box solution ...

Some of my colleagues really feel the cold: some of us are quite comfortable, while they are working in fingerless gloves and with blankets round their shoulders. However if the temperature was actually below 16, I'd make sure we warmed the building up somehow!

celtus

Nobody should be forced to work in cold condidtions inside an office..this is 2012 not the 1900's...Charity or not, they are first and formost regarding the op, the employer and as such face the same laws ect as other workers who work in an office enviroment.


http://www.hse.gov.uk/temperature/law.htm

SarEl

I now can't shake the vision of some employee somewhere living in a cardboard box to stay warm - are you sure this isn't a homelessness charity?