NAME Blacklisted for Car Insurance with Admiral Group?

GSMAnon

I_was_just_wondering wrote: »

Hi GSMAnon

I'm not involved in the insurance industry, so my suggestions may be way off, but...

Are you insured with Admiral group now (or have you been in the past)? Many insurers offer a 'new customer discount'. Could it be that when you enter your correct name it recognises that you as a current/previous customer and removes the discount?

(Some time back, I suspected that my own insurer was declining to quote me online because it was recognising me as an existing customer and they didn't want to undercut their own renewal rate.)

As for locking people out who tweak ages, type of car, overnight parking etc.... based on my experience of ecommerce, this is the sort of thing a competitor might do in order to investigate Admiral's pricing policy. Perhaps because they want to undercut any quote Admiral gives by a few pounds.

For example, Amazon robots constantly gather prices from competitor websites, and then undercut them (allegedly!!!).

So perhaps the websites lock you out because they think you are a competitor's robot gathering data (or human spy from a competitor).

Yes, my previous insurer was Admiral, so I suppose that's plausible.

However, would that explain why the price increases from Bell and Diamond too (Admiral subsidiaries), and why I'm locked out from Elephant?

olly300

GSMAnon wrote: »

Yes, my previous insurer was Admiral, so I suppose that's plausible.

However, would that explain why the price increases from Bell and Diamond too (Admiral subsidiaries), and why I'm locked out from Elephant?

The Admiral group share information within the group just like banking groups do. It's on their website under how they use your personal data.

BTW If you read that section it states they will pass information to National Hunter and other agencies to prevent fraud, so I suggest you never do any quotes with delibrately incorrect information i.e. DOB and address about yourself. Putting incorrect details about a named driver as long as it isn't extreme i.e. putting a year wrong in a DOB, incorrect parking details or slighly wrong car details shouldn't get you locked out.

Parking_Trouble

I still don't get it.

Is there a contractual agreement when using a comparison website, or does it actually start when you tick a box and pay for the policy that you finally choose?

Maybe there is a conflict of interest with insurance companies running comparison sites and supplying quotes from their several group companies? I am sure the regulators must be happy with it so it must be OK.

Personally I find it all a bit too incestuous and I think it whiffs a bit.

In my business if I ask several companies to bid for some work I don't ask one of them to run the bidding process for me. And when I ask for quotes it is not bound by any contract. If I wanted to waste their time (which I would honestly never do) there is no comeback other then they might be a bit miffed but that's all.

When I have chosen the best offer I put pen to paper and we enter a binding contract.

Why is Motor Insurance any different - other then the terms are dictated by the insurer and not negotiated?

mikey72

Maybe we'll see another urban myth starting soon.

Take the first quote, if you shop around, you trying to defraud them and the prices double.

It'll be up there with renewals are supposed to be twice as much, you don't get the first year discount.

anniecave

I can confirm that at least some of the computer systems of the "Admiral" group are very closely connected. I had insurance with Elephant one year, then Bell the next. The claims department email address was the same for each (I had a claim with one, and had to report an accident that wasn't a claim with the other). Also I recall one time I phoned up, the same person could get access to policies on both computer systems somehow.

And I've done my fair share of putting information into quote websites and amending details. Common examples:

Amending mileage
Changing between comprehensive and third party fire and theft
Looking at prices of different postcodes when looking to move house (there's massive differences accross different parts of Birmingham and differences between adjacent roads)
Job descriptions - my previous job used to genuinely come under about 4 categories
Claims and accidents (trying to work out how much my premium might increase if I claim for something minor versus just paying for it myself (but still declaring it to the insurance company of course))
Idle curiosity - how much would my premium be if hadn't had that accident or got those points or if I had a completely different car

What's quite worrying therefore is it would appear the recommended thing to do is to use completely false incorrect details (which seems totally wrong to me!) rather than actually using my real identity...

The computer systerms behind the quoting tools certainly seem to produce some strange results. I remember one time clicking through all the possible excess amounts the system would offer me, and I obviously managed to get a glitch of some sort, because I ended up in the end with a lower excess but at the same premium as before I started changing anything.

And I do also remember one time having to phone up to get a quote over the phone as an online system was refusing to let me proceed to buy even though I'd got a correct quote. Maybe that was because I'd changed the details so many times it was confused!

anniecave

Oh and when I had an accident that I settled privately with the other driver over (as the damage was really minor) Bell were very aggressive at trying to get involved. Even though I said I didn't want to make a claim, they still wrote to the other driver to offer them a courtesy car. I was very annoyed at that!

mikey72

anniecave wrote: »

........ I remember one time clicking through all the possible excess amounts the system would offer me, and I obviously managed to get a glitch of some sort, because I ended up in the end with a lower excess but at the same premium as before I started changing anything..

That's very common.
Excess has no bearing on premium.

Trebor16

mikey72 wrote: »

That's very common.
Excess has no bearing on premium.

It does if you voluntarily take a higher excess than standard.

mikey72

You'd think so.
I had permiums stay the same, or even decrease if I lower the excess, and ones that increase if I raise it.
Always worth trying each option.

Well, unless they then blacklist you for quote massaging.

GSMAnon

Received a reply from Admiral in writing today. Here's some of the key points of their response to my query:

On my query of whether quote massaging had been the cause of the increased premium:

"Firstly, I should clarify that we have not increased your premium due to quote massaging, and it has not been inflated as a result of any fraudulent behaviour. Having spoken to our IT department they have advised me that it could be down to your internet browser settings. However, if you have been declined a quote from elephant.co.uk, there could be a variety of reasons for this. If you can kindly tell me the message which may appear on your screen in relation to this, it would help me to investigate this further. Meanwhile you are welcome to get a quote over the phone from Elephant".

On my query of, if not quote massaging, then why had the premium increased?:

"As I have said in our previous conversations, your name is a part of material facts of the policy. Whilst I appreciate you may not have been able to get a quote from our website using your correct name, it does not mean your premium with a fictional name is correct. We search and share information on a variety of insurance databases and we also conduct a credit search using the name and details of the customer. If any information entered online is not correct, we would be unable to quote a correct premium.

... we use over 30 different rating factors such as your personal information, car details, etc... our rates are determined from complexs statistical models, which look at the claims behaviour of our previous customers.

... I understand you may like to see our evidence of this increased risk in more detail. Unfortunately, we class this as commercially sensitive information, and it is not something we could agree to disclose. This is because it would put us at serious disadvantage should our competitors become aware of it. I should also point out it is not in our interest to artificially inflate our premiums."

---

So, if it's nothing to do with previous quote massaging or suspicious/fraudulent behaviour, then their response seems, in short, to be this:

Our complex statistical models have decided that, purely on the merit of your name, you are at an increased risk of making a claim on any policy we give you, and this is reflected in your premium.

Am I missing something? Is that not what is being suggested? Perhaps people with my surname are more likely to have an accident?

Although, they also said it might well be a problem with my browser? What kind of nonsense is that, then? The browser you use, or the browser settings you have can dictate your premium?!