Huge electricity bill help needed...

jackieb

Whenever i've moved into a new place i've always taken the meter readings. It's one of the first things you have to do. I've always phoned them in to the utility companies myself. Is there a reason this wasn't done?

chanz4

R1 = rate 1 R2 = rate 2, without either you or the letting agents taking reads you dont really have a leg to stand on. Why did you never bother giving your own reads?

mattcanary

Take R1 away from R. That will give you the R2 readfing when you left. You could then give Utility warehouse that reading. That should reduce the bill considerably!

mattcanary

Bear in mind also that sometimes R1 is the day rate and sometimes it is the night rate. It depends upon which area of the country you live in / which company has fitted the meter.

spiro

I don't know about UW's T&Cs but BG require to submit meter readings twice a year. Having read you post it would appear that (a) you failed to phone the suppliert with readings when you moved in, (c) failed to 'correct' any estimated bills while you lived there by phoning the supplier with an actual meter reading and possibly (d) did not hpone the supplier with reading when you moved out.

It looks like you are going to have to pay up. KI would set up a payment plan, and stick to it, before they take you to court which will add hundreds to what you owe.

jalexa

spiro wrote: »

Having read you post it would appear that (a) you failed to phone the suppliert with readings when you moved in, (c) failed to 'correct' any estimated bills while you lived there by phoning the supplier with an actual meter reading and possibly (d) did not hpone the supplier with reading when you moved out.

Well I agree with some of that and there are indeed lessons to be learned. The supplier replies are in some detail, but confusing for all that and I stand to be corrected if I have missed a relevant fact.

One reply states "estimated readings were used to open the account". The reply then gives the dates of two meter "inspector" visits and makes a claim that "each invoice suggests that the account holder provides regular meter readings..." but curiously and perhaps evasively, considering the detail of the reply, makes no dated assertion that any "invoice" or statement was ever sent.

The OP denies receiving the meter "inspector" calling cards and neither does the supplier communication refer to further follow-up attempts - despite later claiming the account was opened to estimated readings.

Yes, the OP has been "naiive" but I do not think there are no holes in the supplier argument. The opening reading is the supplier's estimate (I'd like to know about the previous account holders closing readings) and some 3000 summer day units is - on the face of it - quite an excessive consumption.

I would say the OP has nothing to lose by invoking the Energy Ombudsman, particularly citing the meter "inspector" visits (card or no card?), the lack of any claimed follow-up the absence of any claimed "invoices" or statements.

Cardew

The crucial issue is the start meter readings and the beginning of the tenancy.

It is obviously a possibility that the opening readings were low, and if so the previous tenant has underpaid. However that is now impossible to prove as you apparently failed to check these readings. The bottom line is that the electricity has been used and someone has to pay! Unless you can persuade the previous tenant or letting agent to pay something, the bill is your responsibility.

The other point is that the total consumption for 6 months of 648 night units(kWh) and 3194 day units(kWh) is well below average for an all electric flat. Apart from the fact that on Economy 7 day units are high priced, UW charge a monthly membership fee for the UW club and a monthly standing charge.

I understand also that UW submit monthly bills based on meter readings and it would appear that you never checked or challenged a single bill.

So IMO the bill is not outrageous, and consumption is below average. The bottom line is that it is your responsibility and I cannot see any grounds for challenging UW

Cardew

jalexa wrote: »

Well I agree with some of that and there are indeed lessons to be learned. The supplier replies are in some detail, but confusing for all that and I stand to be corrected if I have missed a relevant fact.

One reply states "estimated readings were used to open the account". The reply then gives the dates of two meter "inspector" visits and makes a claim that "each invoice suggests that the account holder provides regular meter readings..." but curiously and perhaps evasively, considering the detail of the reply, makes no dated assertion that any "invoice" or statement was ever sent.

The OP denies receiving the meter "inspector" calling cards and neither does the supplier communication refer to further follow-up attempts - despite later claiming the account was opened to estimated readings.

Yes, the OP has been "naiive" but I do not think there are no holes in the supplier argument. The opening reading is the supplier's estimate (I'd like to know about the previous account holders closing readings) and some 3000 summer day units is - on the face of it - quite an excessive consumption.

I would say the OP has nothing to lose by invoking the Energy Ombudsman, particularly citing the meter "inspector" visits (card or no card?), the lack of any claimed follow-up the absence of any claimed "invoices" or statements.

UW are like no other utility company(and I am no fan)

I believe the 'normal' method of billing UW customers is monthly on-line bills based on meter readings, which the customer has to supply or they estimate. Monthly paper bills cost a little extra. The T&Cs say customers must provide meter readings

UW charges are high if you don't use loads of cheap rate electricity - day rate can be over 21p/kWh for all used(they don't have a tier rate system)

Personally I don't think under 4,000kWh in 6 months for an all electric flat high. Hot water - cooking - washing - dishwasher? a little heating.

Without being harsh, it seems the OP has taken absolutely no interest in his electricity account until he got hit with the final bill.

Unless the previous tenant was as lax as the OP in submitting monthly meter readings, there is every likelyhood that the closing/opening readings at start of OP's tenancy would be reasonably accurate.

rule

Hi

Thanks for the responses, I thought that I did take meter readings when I moved in and that I provided them by phone but they say that I didn't ...lesson learned to take meter readings every month ...
The landlord didn't provide me with a meter key though and eventually I had to buy one myself ...

If they don't have substantial evidence to what the actual meter reading was when I moved in how can the only charge based on an actual (final) - estimate .. it doesn't make sense as I am paying for a "we think" figure...

I just drafted an email and i'll post it to see what you guys think...i'll keep you updated.

rule

This is what I've drafted let me know what you think . e.g if anything worth adding etc



To Customer services, Senior management, Bill dispute teams
Dear Sir / Madam
Per my previous correspondence this bill is inaccurate and unclear.
>>I have recommended that you speak to your letting agents to see if they have a recoded of any actual meter readings showing on your entry inventory, as we will be able to make any adjustments on receipt of this documentation. I understand that they have not been very helpful with this matter, however, I would persevere as this will be the easiest way to resolve these issues.

I am getting misleading responses and poor customer service above as clearly this is not true..

These were your responses in the previous email:
“I reiterate his comments that we will be able to make amendments to the closing meter readings if they are confirmed as incorrect by the new tenants” … “I suggest that you contact them and request that they obtain the actual meter readings.”
So you never proposed that, it was only after my question (Another concern is that even if we did get an up to date meter reading, that would also include the usage that the new tenant is using from 30 October 2011 to date isn't that correct ? .. doesn't that means that again the final total will be based on an estimate ?)
Only after my response challnging the accuracy and the validity of the request that you proposed your suggestion was different !!!


>>A meter inspector attempted to visited the property to read the meter on 28 June 2011 and 6 July 2011 but they were not able to gain access.

• The code of practice of accurate bills states that if you can’t access the meter the energy company will ask me to take the reading, It seems that the process has not been followed . I can confirm that I had no contact from yourselves to do so and no calling card was left , so why wasn’t I notified?
• I understand that you don’t have a meter reading for druation of the tenancy / time on the property but that you do have a meter reading for the previous last two years as required by law if yes can I please know when is the earliest one and have the attached document that proves it.

Code of Practice for Accurate Bills

The Code of Practice for Accurate Bills says, among other things, that:

• your energy supplier should try to read your meter at least every two years. If it can't access your meter, the energy company will ask you to take a reading
• if you do not receive a bill for more than a year and it is the energy supplier’s fault, you do not have to pay any outstanding debt for energy you used more than a year ago.

>>Our records show that the payments totalling £229.09 have been received for the account. The remaining balance of £456.79 is for the charges showing on the latest December invoice and does not reference your pervious payments made.

Why does not reference them if we take down they start figures and end figures it should do as this would be teh actual and the previous ones was estimates ! you should reestimate (subtract)

Furthermore I asked on my previous email what R means for this reading, I provided R1 and R.
The R is the R2 reading, in the bill that you sent me you have used for day reading as night reading and the night reading as day reading even though that the difference is not hugh this adds to the innacuracy of the whole bill and you will need to revise this (see email with final readings that I sent) .

Final bill:
Meter reader's Day reading: 30-10-2011 6347
Meter reader's Day reading: 30-10-2011 8990
Units 2643
Kilowatt-hours 2643
Pence per kilowatt-hour 17.018
Meter reader's Night reading: 30-10-2011 9236
Meter reader's Night reading: 30-10-2011 8889
Units -347
Kilowatt-hours -347
Pence per kilowatt-hour 4.250
Total cost of electricity used (excluding VAT) £ 435.04

At this stage I would also like to request a copy of all my previous bills by email or post

>>I reiterate that it is extremely unlikely that the meter was running fast, rather your increased usage is due to the first actual meter readings being received on the account as you vacated the address.

I will take this comment as an agreement that the initial data / estimate was wrong and that you acknowledge that the charge is excessive!!

Again I am putting down my personal profile
My personal profile :
I am a single person and I was working from 8:30-18:00 every day in Hemel hempstead.
I didn't watch TV when I was living in the property.
My oven was not working for the first three months and when this was fixed eventually I was not cooking much.
There was no Gas in the property and only electric, however the heating didn't come on until 01:00 in the morning automatically (when it was switched on) therefore this would go to the night reading, the actual night reading is lower than the estimate and that says a lot !!!
Even though that heating therefore is not applicable, in the summer months July - August -September I wasn't even using the heaters and that will explain the low estimate .
Dishwasher was not used in the property.
I never leave any electrical appliances or lights on
The only thing that was continuously open during the day was the fridge and I am pretty sure that this doesn’t consume anything as much!!
So given the information above this charge is completely outrageous
Please use common sense, in this case you are asking me to pay almost 3000kws ,and a total of 700gbp for the difference only in the day reading, for times that I was not even in the house and a hugh portion in the bill was during the summer months!!!

>>I can confirm that following your discussion with our offices, a hold has been placed on the account for 30 days

Please keep the hold for as long it needs to be and provide me with a confirmation of this ,
Do not request payments at this stage or try to take money from my account this will be deemed as an unlawful debit.
Please note that if you try to debit my account without authorization this payment will be challenged.
I am not convinced that I owe this money if you can't provide any substansial evidence that they justify that .

>>During your time at the property, we did not receive any actual meter readings; therefore, >>we are not able to establish a correct consumption history for you

This is to substansiate my claim above.. so on what basis are you charging me this amount when you are clearly admitting that you don’t have a correct consumption history?

.
Please note that you have every right to estimate but this charge should be justified and reasonable and clearly it's not
Taking in consideration the fact that you don’t have a correct consumption history I am happy to accept the initial estimates already paid (even though that they are just estimates and it doesn’t mean that they are correct) and not pay the 450gbp extra.
To put this right I would expect you to completely discard the request of 450 in which case I am willing to make a goodwill payment of 100gbp and that we shall both agree that the money already paid as estimates during the tenancy covers the total for this account.

Your faithfully

P