Traction control or 4x4 in ice and snow?

Lum

I'm guessing that half way through that video the ice at the bottom of the hill had gone away as the later cars all slide down and then suddenly gain grip and lurch in whatever direction their wheels were pointing. The ones filmed at night time just continue sliding towards the filmer's garden wall.

At least the landy didn't hit anything, that would've been expensive! I suspect that was down to luck though.

And yeah, mud tyres aren't so great. Makes you think about how good M+S marked car tyres are likely to be, doesn't it?

forgotmyname

2WD or 4WD they all slide off the road when driven by idiots who think they are invincible.

Watching the news last year i noticed how many 4x4's there were in the ditches. 4WD helps you
pull away when there is little grip, Once moving you have the same amount of grip as a 2WD car
So will slide off exactly the same.

A 4x4 will have more chance of getting back out of the ditch than a 2WD car. As already said traction control
cuts the engines power to reduce wheelspin. But 4WD is better as long as you know its limits.

sunshinetours

Strider590 wrote: »

Those knobbly mud tyre's, not suited to ice/snow. Another misconception being that chunky, knobbly tyres will be great in cold weather. By that logic, it's like climbing Snowdon in a pair of ice skates.

Winter M&S marked tyres will be best as the compound won't harden in cold temps - regular M&S marked tyres will not be great for ice (but if its that icy then nothing will be great lets face it short of spiked winters)

Gloomendoom

Strider590 wrote: »

Those knobbly mud tyre's, not suited to ice/snow. Another misconception being that chunky, knobbly tyres will be great in cold weather. By that logic, it's like climbing Snowdon in a pair of ice skates.

Knobbly tyres are very good in deep snow but you are right, on the hard packed stuff, unless snow rated, they are useless.

Lum wrote: »

And yeah, mud tyres aren't so great. Makes you think about how good M+S marked car tyres are likely to be, doesn't it?

My car has M+S tyres and it was fine last winter. Here and in the Pyrenees.

epninety

vax2002 wrote: »

A 4x4 is not a 4wd, 4wd drive vehicles tend to be known as soft roaders, if one wheel looses traction, the power is just spun out on that wheel.
a 4x4 vehicle has a system of limiting revolutions per wheel such as a limited slip differential or viscous coupling as used in Renault rx4.
in a 4x4 if one wheel has lost traction the power is distributed to the other 3 wheels, in a 4wd, if one slips, thats it.

So is a typical Land Rover or LR Defender a "soft-roader" in your world?
(Not referring to the latest models with electronics strapped on)

Never seen anyone try to draw a distinction between 4wd and 4x4 before. 4x4 means 4 wheels, 4 driven.

Before anyone gets pedantic - a non electronic Defender can potentially not drive with 2 wheels slipping, with all (one) standard traction aids engaged.

Weird_Nev

vax2002 wrote: »

A 4x4 is not a 4wd, 4wd drive vehicles tend to be known as soft roaders, if one wheel looses traction, the power is just spun out on that wheel.
a 4x4 vehicle has a system of limiting revolutions per wheel such as a limited slip differential or viscous coupling as used in Renault rx4.
in a 4x4 if one wheel has lost traction the power is distributed to the other 3 wheels, in a 4wd, if one slips, thats it.

That's a bizarre distinction to make. And I don't think you understand how a viscous differential works either.

There is now a whole spectrum of four wheel drive systems - from mechanical diff locks and fully user controleld gears through to very complex and effective electronic systems to use standard differentials and the vehicles brakes to vector torque.
You can't make simple distintions about "4x4 vs 4WD" any more. Unless you course you're a greenlaner with a jacked up landy series 2 and an inferiority complex.

datostar

mustrum_ridcully wrote: »

Well ladies and gentlemen looks like it's time to air one of my favourite youtube videos about people driving in snow/ice.

Of all the cars featured it's the proper "lets off-road" Landrover Defender (at 3:00) probably fares the worst and manages to end-up facing the wrong way up the hill.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FpQoAjM_M8

I used to drive one as a blue light emergency vehicle. Potential problems:-
1. Going straight on at corners.
2. Sideways slide - pretty uncontrollable and hope there's nothing there to hit.
3. Deepish snow would cause hard-packed build up behind the front hubs and lock the steering. Remedy - stop and poke it out. Carry suitable implement.
4. Front winch not much good for pulling other vehicles out of snowdrifts. Tended to pull the Land Rover in rather than the other one out. Probably OK for self-recovery (as intended) as long as there's a suitable tree or suchlike nearby to hook to.

Any vehicle, 4WD or whatever, is a handful in snow and ice so keep the speed down and use extreme caution. In the area I worked it wasn't uncommon for Army drivers of tracked vehicles to come unstuck as well. Tractors seem to cope best of all.

DTDfanBoy

vax2002 wrote: »

A 4x4 is not a 4wd, 4wd drive vehicles tend to be known as soft roaders, if one wheel looses traction, the power is just spun out on that wheel.
a 4x4 vehicle has a system of limiting revolutions per wheel such as a limited slip differential or viscous coupling as used in Renault rx4.
in a 4x4 if one wheel has lost traction the power is distributed to the other 3 wheels, in a 4wd, if one slips, thats it.

It may just be the fact I'm from NZ so am unfamiliar with UK terminology, but it sounds to me like you're confusing AWD and 4WD.

A 4WD whether permanent or part time has the ability to lock the front and rear differentials to each other, an AWD vehicle does not.

In a 4WD the only way of only having drive to one wheel is if you don't have something engaged, free wheeling hubs, or even 4WD itself if you're in a part timer and you really don't have a clue

The RX4 you mention is what I would consider to be an AWD, in the majority of off-road situations a 4WD is generally preferable. It does seem however that some AWD systems are now more capable than they used to be, the majority used to be pretty rubbish.

Gloomendoom

Hmmm... The Kia Sportage 4x4 has an AWD badge on the front wing. It also has a centre diff lock.

The exception that proves the rule?

lovesgshp

Would use the X-Trail, but with winter tyres on. Have a 1992 Mitsubishi Pajero LWB here in Italy. We have to have winter tyres on after certain dates, or carry snow chains as well, otherwise fines are heavy!! Pajero, with its combination of drive formats, can usually cope with virtualy all situations. Citroen, even with winter tyres often needs chains fitted in the snow.
One of the best small cars here is the Fiat Panda 4x4.

Or, how about this!!!
http://autotraderblog.co.uk/2009/12/30/subaru-impreza-pulls-lorry-out-of-snow/