Are we entitled to anything?

confusedone

Im currently 35, married with children aged 18 months and 6 years old.

I am a full time student. I attend 15 hours per week and 6 months ago i was assessed and given JSA - it was almost definitely a mistake so ive had a good run of it. I am in my 2nd/final year of a foundation degree, and the jobcentre have said that they are sorry and are pretty sure it was a mistake. Very likely when i sign on next they will tell me that i wont be getting any money.

I didnt get any student finance, wasnt entitled as i am/was a registered nurse and as the course is a same level qualification then i wasnt entitled -appealed but this is definite.

If im told when i go next that in 3 days time i wont be getting any money (we live on this just about), is there anything we will be entitled to?

At present i get JSA, child tax credit and housing benefit.

Can my wife claim anything? Or can I?

Ive been told that if i wanted to continue getting anything at all i would have to leave the course that day,and get a letter from college stating i have left.

The college have offered to turn it into a part time course, just take longer to qualify.

I self fund (sold stuf, begged and borrowed) the course if that makes any difference to any feedback.

Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated, as i only have around 16 weeks of actual study time left and we will be gutted to be back to square one.

All input greatly appreciated

Alan

Killmark

Is your wife working or do you have a joint claim with her and she doesn't sign on because she's the one with child care responsibilities?

On the student side of things as its under 16hrs a week unless the provider states that it is a full time course then in theory it shouldn't stop you receiving JSA.

Anyway if you have a couple claim with your wife then close it down and have her make a new claim, if she is the primary claimant of a couple claim and signs on. Due to the children ages she could sign for the both of you and your student status wouldn't make any difference as you don't receive funding.

confusedone

Killmark wrote: »

Is your wife working or do you have a joint claim with her and she doesn't sign on because she's the one with child care responsibilities?

On the student side of things as its under 16hrs a week unless the provider states that it is a full time course then in theory it shouldn't stop you receiving JSA.

Anyway if you have a couple claim with your wife then close it down and have her make a new claim, if she is the primary claimant of a couple claim and signs on. Due to the children ages she could sign for the both of you and your student status wouldn't make any difference as you don't receive funding.

Thanks for the reply.

Wife doesnt work no, and yes it is a joint claim.

The jobcente asked for the learner agreement and it states it is 15 hours study, but they are going to phone the college and ask if it is full time or part time, as it doesnt state it is full or part time on learner agreement - they WILL say it is classed as full time, as it is.

If the jobcentre are aware of my situation(they are), isnt it obvious that by closing the claim and have her make a new claim to get joint benefit, that we are just trying to manipulate it in some way?

confusedone

Pretty worried as i will probably be going in tomorrow to see an advisor, and if i say 'hey can my wife claim jsa and claim for us both' they may well say, sorry but your money is stopped. Worrying times.

Just to add, there are some circumstances i heard that i could still study, but have to be on JSA for over a year, ive been on it 6 months, lost my job in may. Had an interview for 16 hour job today and if successful this would make this problem go away - although the job requires CRB and that can take 1-2 months, and this is if i have been successful, find out on Monday. Could be a grim christmas if they stop the money or if i come off course.

Killmark

confusedone wrote: »

Thanks for the reply.

Wife doesnt work no, and yes it is a joint claim.

The jobcente asked for the learner agreement and it states it is 15 hours study, but they are going to phone the college and ask if it is full time or part time, as it doesnt state it is full or part time on learner agreement - they WILL say it is classed as full time, as it is.

If the jobcentre are aware of my situation(they are), isnt it obvious that by closing the claim and have her make a new claim to get joint benefit, that we are just trying to manipulate it in some way?

Full time study can be anything over 12hrs a week, when you complete the training/education form it asks for how many hours you are doing etc and the adviser will normally ask for a learning agreement to ensure it is under 16hrs (what jcp considers full time) and that the college/uni consider it is part time, the decision maker should then make a decision. As it stands the college is at risk of data protection breach if they give any information to the JCP over phone without your consent if they just called up and asked.

but anyway

As a joint claim couple your wife is exempted from the labour market conditionality such as availability of work due to childcare, the purpose of the student rules is to ensure availability and actively seeking thus if she is the main claimant (Actively seeking full time employment and available) then you would not be penalised for studying part time and providing childcare, if however she refused suitable fulltime employment as per her job seekers agreement then the claim would be sanctioned (most likely).

confusedone

Killmarkm thanks for the reply. I have been assessed initially, it was sent to a decision maker, but i have been told that there are 2 decision makers in different places or departments or even organisations?? One assesses if we are eligible for JSA - i was deemed that i was, gave my hours in etc. But the jobcentre have told me that there is another decision maker who assesses availability for work. This is the one that is getting reviewed, if that makes sense.

Wife is happy to go on JSA and sign on. Realistically if a job come up then we could easily manage it, although i am technically on a full time course, the college are more than supportive and have even offered to do most of it distance learning. It is the fact that i am enrolled on it that seems to be an issue with the jobcentre. I attend 12 hours, that can easily be cut down to 2-4 hours providing i actually got assignments done.

I was told today that it is very likely that our money would be stopped. today was signing on day, the lady let me sign on and said we would get money this time but we will be called in asap for a review. I have emailed college to say i wont be going in tomorrow as really worried and am going to try see an advisor first thing tomorrow to know where we will stand. Wife has said she will come with me, but if we say 'cant my wife claim jsa', with me being still classed as a full time student but taking responsibility for the children, what would be the possible outcome? Could they agree that is a fair outcome, or as i suspect, them saying no as we are not entitled and are just doing this as they are stopping our money?

Appreciate your, or anyones input!

Alan

confusedone

And again i guess i would be still classed as studying fulltime and providing childcare?

Killmark

confusedone wrote: »

And again i guess i would be still classed as studying fulltime and providing childcare?

Currently your wife and you both receive JSA, just your wife is exempted from labour market conditions. My suggestions is you swap roles and she signs for the both of you instead.

Your student status won't make a difference in that case if you are the exempted parent unless you received financial support as a student thus affecting the amount of means tested benefits received.

Only problem you would have is you cant just switch the main claimants over, the old claim would have to be closed and a new one made so sooner the better.

In regards to the availability it will all come down to what you filled in on the form, i.e if you have a jobseekers agreement stating you are available for work within 24hrs but you have filled the form to state you are available in a week then it will show lack of availability. Or another example, your jobseekers agreement shows you available for any hours but your set college hours on the form show you arent, thus this shows you aren't available.

Avail/Ase is done either in office and if unable to make a decision (i.e reasonable doubt) then it is referred to Decision Making team who access it based on the social security acts and legal precedent. All of which is horribly complicated.

confusedone

As of today they have suspended our benefits. 2 points - course is classed as full time AND as they never funded the course.

Await a call to see if we can claim with my wife claiming JSA...they didnt seem very positive that that was an option.

Killmark

confusedone wrote: »

As of today they have suspended our benefits. 2 points - course is classed as full time AND as they never funded the course.

Point 1: They declined on availability.
Point 2: Is only relevant if they funded or sent you on a mandatory course which would have affected your availability.

confusedone wrote: »

Await a call to see if we can claim with my wife claiming JSA...they didnt seem very positive that that was an option.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Then ask for a reason in writing from your JCP, if necessary citing the relevant legislation. However they should look be able to see from the guidance on the intranet that there is no reason[/FONT] why you couldn't do this.

Personally I think the attitude is discriminatory.