Resign or wait and probably get fired?

Munchkin_monster

Hello, just to let you know I am a regular using a new name. I am hoping for some help here as really confused on whats best. SarlE I hope you are about.

I have worked solidly for the last 15 years and had a good work record. After several years with one company I moved to a competitor where I wanted to get more experience in my field. The job in itself is the same as my last role with my previous employer but the hours are longer and I have struggled. Full time is fine and I was used to 40-50 hours but this is 50 hours more often than not if not more.

I have been off for 4 weeks and signed off for another 2. I am too scared to go back as I know they want to get rid of me and with under a year I have no defence. Due to a few incidents (2 i admit too although petty and 2 I dont as I was sick from stress and went off almost immediatey after both). I can see why I have not been the employee they need but at the same time I have been very unwell with little to no support from them.

I have been asked to attend a disiplinerary at the end of the month where I strongly suspect I will be fired. The letter did not list any other forms of punishment.

This is a large blue chip company and although I am very happy not to work for them anymore the question is do I resign before the hearing or at least defend myself but possibly be fired? I am job hunting as we speak!

Many thanks
MM

PS sorry for spelling no spell check on here.

Sambucus_Nigra

What sort of incidents? Do they constitute Gross Misconduct? And did you disappear on sick leave straight after them, or is the sick leave totally unrelated?

Did the letter say that the disciplinary might end up with your dismissal?

Uncertain

Are you currently signed off sick?

If so, are you getting company sick pay?

Again, if so do you know the EXACT terms of the sick pay? Is it contractual or discretionary?

The reason I ask is that if you are entitled to, say, three months sick pay and it is not discretionary the company would have to pay you for this (obviously subject to medical certificates, even if they terminated your employment).

Under such circumstances it would be stupid to resign unless you have another job to go to.

Equally, if you need to claim JSA, it will be easier if you don't resign.

SarEl

Addes to which - they have already notified you of the disciplinary. So any reference may include a reference to the fact that you resigned pending a disciplinary. That is an open advertisement to the world that you are guilty. So in many ways, it cannot actually get any worse. What did you / didn't you do?

Munchkin_monster

Hi thanks for youur replies Ill try to answer all the questions

1) Yes letter states dimmisal a possibility
2) on sick leave now no sick pay but they have paid me almost in full so expecting them to collect that back

3 what I did wrong

a) had a go at a member of staff when she was rude to me but they complained. It was out of charater for me due to stress in my personel life which the company knew about but not this person. I admitted partial fault.

b) due to stress and not feeling trained well enough i didnt complete some work and changed my diary to catch up. manager was in hospital so i didnt call and didnt call another manager. went sick for 2 weeks after that hoping to sort out the personal stuff.

can back and worked ok for a few weeks but at my 3 months review they surprised me with a final verbal warning for the above two incidents.

c) had been working well for a month after above but was doing long hours and trying not to mess up again. then i had a complaint for taking personal call whilst on site. 2 calls for no more than 5 mins in total. they also staed i said I would call back which i didnt. this i never promised.

d) after finding about the above complaint i felf demotivated and began to not trust my judgement this along with the long hours meant I was struggling with the slightest thing and realised I was still stressed despite the earlier time off. I tried to keep working and asked for part time but this wasnt accepted. I even had the doctor write a letter to request shorter hours or pressure. anyways i kept trying to work but found I couldnt work to speed as I was doubting evething I did and it was taking too long. I realised at 6 one evening that I couldnt complete my work for the next day and wasnt able to go in. this resulted in another complaint as per b in failing to diary manage. i have been signed off since.

a and c i know i messed up but dont see either as material mistakes and b and d were both where I was severly unwell through stress and couldnt think straight. b i was still fairly new and could do that in my last role d i let my manager know as soon as i could so i dont understand the fault.

hope you can follow this.

SarEl

OK. Well it doesn't sound like much of a place to owrk for, but there's not really much that can be done about that, and you are in a weak position. I agree that the reasons for the disciplinaries appear to be weak, but as you correctly pointed out, without a years employment you are pretty screwed anyway. If you are set upon resignation as an acceptable course, then I would suggest contacting the employer and asking them whether they would agree to provide a neutral reference in return for your resignation - that is, a reference which does not mention the disciplinary allegations. That is probably the best outcome that you could hope for, although it is obviously far from ideal. The problem with such an agreement is that they do not have to keep to it - it depends upon their honesty whther they will or they won't. I can't see them being willing to enter into a compromise agreement (which would make them keep their promise) because that involves cost, and they have no cause to want to pay for something that they don't have to. But if the refuse (or don't keep to the agreement) then it puts you in no worse a place than you are in already.

Munchkin_monster

Thanks, I had a feeling that is what you would say. Is it at least worth defending myself at the hearing? I plan to write a letter to counteract their claims and submit it to the person in charge. Im just so disappointed that this can happen after working so hard over the years that this company can ruin my reputation.

SarEl

Munchkin_monster wrote: »

Thanks, I had a feeling that is what you would say. Is it at least worth defending myself at the hearing? I plan to write a letter to counteract their claims and submit it to the person in charge. Im just so disappointed that this can happen after working so hard over the years that this company can ruin my reputation.

I would do nothing until you have done what I suggested. Putting their backs up by arguing with them isn't conducive to getting what you want! If they refuse then you have nothing else to loose so you may as well defend yourself at the disciplinary.

dandelionclock30

You could defend yourself at the hearing and if they wont budge and its looking bleak and they want to dismiss you, then ask to resign.I think you will be able to tell how its going.
You know your employer, do you think they may be willing to give you another chance? Only you can decide what to do for the best.
You definatley need to bring up the reference issue with them because you dont want a reference with dismissed on it.
If you have a neutral reference it shouldnt ruin your reputation.A lot of companies now just do basic references.As most employers ask for 2 references, you can always put a good one down for the other referee.
Have you got a union rep to support you in the hearing,as it will be stressfull doing this yourself.

Munchkin_monster

Thanks no union rep as my grade is a higher level from what I can see. Not been there long enough to know what else there is and also not enough time to find a collegue that may be willing to sit in with me. Occupational health just said go back to work and face the hearing! Just feels like a huge joke at the moment. A netrual reference is all I want so i can on with my life so will aim for that.

BobQ

SarEl's advice seems sound.

Munchkin_monster wrote: »

3 what I did wrong

b) due to stress and not feeling trained well enough i didnt complete some work and changed my diary to catch up.

d) ...... this resulted in another complaint as per b in failing to diary manage. i have been signed off since.


.

What does this reference to diary actually mean? You do not have to explain here and its probably unwise to do so.

But I was wondering if changing a diary refers to altering an auditable record of some kind (ie something you are required to complete as part of your firm's processes that logs decisions, quality records or attendance) changing which could be considered as gross misconduct particularly if you personally benefited from doing it.