Discrimination and Unlawful deductions?

BottomRung

Anyway this is going nowhere, I guess it's hard to communicate the situation i'm in without sounding whiny or out of order and it's a case of non smokers versus smokers which isnlt a debate i want to get into. My original question is whether these rules are lawful or not and whether the deduction was done within the law also.

Any

Seriously, anyone here actually think it is acceptable to be deducted 30 mins or have to work 30 mins just because one is registered as a smoker????? And deduct it on a whim?

What about coffee drinkers? When you have to go and boil a kettle? You are good 10 mins away from your desk... ? So why not?

Sorry, I cannot see how this is right.
Either they need to refuse any smoking breaks what so ever (we don't have any - if you want ciggie you go at lunchtime) or introduce clocking system.
OR
Introduce a new system, new addittion to contract of employment where they will change your working hours, including 2 15mins breaks. Or did they do that? And then once you signed that this is what you want it is your problem you didn't take that break. Not the companies.

Because to be completely fair, there does need to be some system. You will always find people taking a mickey and company needs to regulate it somehow, without having to have a person standing by the door writing notes down on number of ciggies smoked.

skintandscared_2

Never heard anything so ridiculous. It takes me 4 minutes to go down the back stairs, have a ciggie and get back to my desk. I'm quicker than the ones who disappear to make tea and coffee (I don't drink either).

I rarely stop for lunch and my ciggie breaks don't take up anywhere near the unpaid lunchhour.

It's about give and take. I've regularly come in early or stayed late to finish something but if I had someone like that monitoring my breaks there's no way they'd get a minute extra out of me, that's for sure!!

anamenottaken

If you are not taking the break at the designated time (and not at any other time), then you are making up the time in the day of the break.

HappyMJ

BottomRung wrote: »

I assume you don't smoke? As a smoker of 20 years it's really not that simple i'm afraid. Another thing is, sometimes i'm expected to go out for the company or stay later to finish urgent jobs which, as i'm on a salary, I don't get paid for. It kind of makes this impossible as now I refuse to give them any extra of my time. All this is in reality for a quick 5 min break in the morning and a quick 5 min break in the afternoon. I wouldn't even take 15 mins to have a cigarette.

In fact I do smoke and I schedule when I can in the work day. I start up to 15 minutes early (not doing a huge amount really-just turning on workstation getting a cup of coffee, settling in and start on some paperwork before the official start time) and finish up to 15 minutes late (usually just cleaning up work area) and I'll take additional breaks during the day or take a longer or shorter dinner break when required. My non-smoking colleagues also do the same however, they might finish an hour early on the Friday due to the lack of smoking breaks during the week. The bonus with my workplace is that my working time is flexible within reason. I may work an hour extra on a Monday night and not claim for it where other colleagues will then I might start 30 minutes later than others. If you want to keep a schedule of when you start work, leave your workstation, return to your workstation and when you leave for the day and make sure the total weekly amount worked is no less than what you are contracted to work for. With smoking during work hours it must be give and take.

Anyway this is going nowhere, I guess it's hard to communicate the situation i'm in without sounding whiny or out of order and it's a case of non smokers versus smokers which isnlt a debate i want to get into. My original question is whether these rules are lawful or not and whether the deduction was done within the law also.

The deductions are lawful if it does not bring your salary below minimum wage for the hours you have worked. You have agreed to register a smoker and work 30 minutes more per day and to take 30 minutes of extra breaks per day. My advice is to deregister from the smoker register or just take the breaks anyway and try and avoid smoking.

BottomRung

Any wrote: »

Seriously, anyone here actually think it is acceptable to be deducted 30 mins or have to work 30 mins just because one is registered as a smoker????? And deduct it on a whim?

What about coffee drinkers? When you have to go and boil a kettle? You are good 10 mins away from your desk... ? So why not?

Sorry, I cannot see how this is right.
Either they need to refuse any smoking breaks what so ever (we don't have any - if you want ciggie you go at lunchtime) or introduce clocking system.
OR
Introduce a new system, new addittion to contract of employment where they will change your working hours, including 2 15mins breaks. Or did they do that? And then once you signed that this is what you want it is your problem you didn't take that break. Not the companies.

Because to be completely fair, there does need to be some system. You will always find people taking a mickey and company needs to regulate it somehow, without having to have a person standing by the door writing notes down on number of ciggies smoked.

Thanks fior understanding me, we DO have a clocking system and must clock out for our breaks if we take one but still must make up the time of we don't. And the time must be made up after work not during the break. My contract hasn't changed to signify any of this. Its quite depressing really as prior to this i was a model employee, now i'm made to be not so good because of a rule change. What makes it worse is the one person that was taking the mickey and caused all thses rule changes has quit smoking so we are left with the flak.. He's not so popular at the moment.

getmore4less

Who is giving this person the authority to make up these rules?
Thats the person you need to deal with.

You need to push back, like say no meetings at smole break time,
Take the full 15mins
Plan you days so there is lower likelyhood of interuptions.

I would also consider putting in a grievance for the deduction.

mrsp80

I'm afraid smoking is not a protected characteristic in terms of employment law so it's not discrimination.

It does sound like a silly rule that you have to do an extra half hour even if you are not taking the breaks! Is there no one you can talk to about this, a line manager for example?

RadoJo

I can see why the company don't want to waste their time in monitoring every smoker, when they take their breaks and when they make their time up. You say that they 'keep changing the rules' but from what I can see the rule has only changed once so far, and it does seem reasonable to expect everyone to make up the time on the same day to avoid complicated arrangements with people making up time here, there and everywhere, so perhaps it's not just a question of 'losing face' but the company losing productivity from their staff which has lead to the rules not being changed.
I can also understand that when people use milk for cereal when it's only bought for use in tea and coffee, it means that it is being used at a much greater rate than the company are prepared to provide. I don't think any of these rules are petty and in fact most companies would not allow either smoke breaks or the widespread consumption of cereal during working hours. I think you are letting your frustration cloud the issue and if you want to approach the matter with the woman controlling the rules, it may be best to avoid any references to her role in the matter and stick to the bare facts.

bobajob_1966

anamenottaken wrote: »

If you are not taking the break at the designated time (and not at any other time), then you are making up the time in the day of the break.

Excellent, common sense answer.

OP, I actually think the employer is being flexible here. If you want to take extra breaks to smoke, you can opt into this scheme. If you do not, you opt out. What is difficult about that?

(And yes, I am a smoker.)