a postgrad degree may help get a better salary after all....

melancholly

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=26&storycode=418024&c=1

interesting article - perhaps it shows how much HE has changed since undergrad degrees are so common, so a postgrad degree is a marker to set people apart. the difference in salary for those with a masters in the US is also surprisingly large.

most frighteningly, the number of people doing a PhD has risen 81% between 1996/7 to 2009/10. there aren't 80% more jobs requiring a PhD......

i'm sure the changes to HE that are about to start will completely change this, but in terms of earning potential, a postgrad degree still looks useful. although with funding as it is and increased fees with no loans for a masters, it would be surprising if the numbers of people doing masters courses continued to increase.

Oldernotwiser

So, all the people from families who can support them through a post grad degree will now have an advantage over those who can't.

Words fail me when I look at what's been done to our education system.

Voyager2002

An interesting talking point, but I suspect that by looking at averages this news item conceals very important differences among the holders of different kinds of post-graduate qualifications. For example, the population of those holding a masters course probably includes all solicitors and barristers (their post-graduate qualification is at masters level) as well as business people with an MBA, and these groups are among the highest-paid professionals in the country. Their experiences are unlikely to tell us anything about people who take a masters in a non-vocational subject (such as history).

What I find very surprising, but just about believable, is the salary advantage that a PhD confers. For a start, this cannot be about academics (the most obvious career option following a PhD), because academics are not among the county's high earners. And for most non-academic jobs, a PhD confers only a minimal (and quite possibly a negative!) advantage over someone with a masters degree at the point of getting the job. Furthermore, a PhD takes a good few years, so someone starting a non-academic career with a PhD is likely to be older than graduates starting at a similar point in the organisation, and so the person with a PhD would be recorded as earning a lower salary than graduates of the same age working in the same career.

The advantage of a PhD, of course, is that anyone who manages to complete has developed traits such as self-reliance and perseverance, as well as a range of skills that are applicable to the workplace, and in the longer term this is likely to lead to faster promotion and salary progression than the norm for the field. It is interesting and perhaps surprising that the survey evidence suggests that this is large enough to overcome the disadvantages that I outlined in the previous paragraph.

Voyager2002

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

So, all the people from families who can support them through a post grad degree will now have an advantage over those who can't.

Words fail me when I look at what's been done to our education system.

No, not all. I suspect that many courses give no salary advantage, while some give an enormous salary advantage.

Remember also that many of the most able people do find ways to finance the study they want to do, and go on to earn very high salaries: a phenomenon that will be reflected in the average figures that the report quotes.

MrsManda

In many ways it is obvious that people with PG qualifications earn more than people with UG qualifications just as people with UG qualifications earn more than those without UG qualifications.

This doesn't mean it happens across the board, that everyone with X qualification will earn more than everyone with Y qualification. But one of the things the discussion paper looks at is the top five occupations of people who fall into each educational category and the average salary of each occupation.

Top occupations for people with postgraduate qualifications include statisticians, actuaries, and software professionals.

The top occupations for people with higher postgraduate qualifications include medical professionals and bioscientists.

A lot of occupations which are high paid require much more study than an undergraduate degree. Legal representatives, medical professionals, accountants, high level engineers all require postgraduate qualifications of one sort or another. In many cases this progression comes as you work your way up the ranks rather than going back to school and paying your own fees as experience is just is important as qualifications though one without the other won't get you far.

Oldernotwiser

MrsManda wrote: »

Top occupations for people with postgraduate qualifications include statisticians, actuaries, and software professionals.

The top occupations for people with higher postgraduate qualifications include medical professionals and bioscientists.

A lot of occupations which are high paid require much more study than an undergraduate degree. Legal representatives, medical professionals, accountants, high level engineers all require postgraduate qualifications of one sort or another.

But the point I was making is that it's only comparatively recently that post grad degrees were required for most of the careers you mention. In the past, an undergraduate degree was at a high enough level to be appropriate but the dumbing down of the educational system now means that post graduate degrees are required.

This has led to a situation where 40% of the population now starts university but only those from comfortably off families (with some exceptions) will have the post grad qualification now required. A process that may have been initiated in the name of equality has now swung back to a situation where only those from the right backgrounds can progress to higher earning careers.

Oldernotwiser

Voyager2002 wrote: »

Remember also that many of the most able people do find ways to finance the study they want to do, and go on to earn very high salaries: a phenomenon that will be reflected in the average figures that the report quotes.

One would certainly hope that the most able would be able to access what post grad funding there is but in some areas it barely exists. Apart from public funding, I can't see many ways in which the most able would be able to to finance post grad study.

atypical

There's no need to guess at the occupations, the top 5 occupations for those with a degree, masters or doctorate are listed in the original report. It's an easy read and has a more information than the Times article:
http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/cp351.pdf

For those with a doctorate: 20.7% higher education teaching professionals, 11% medical practitioners, 7.1% bioscientists/biochemists, 3.2% researchers, 3.1% software professionals. None of those strike as very high earning professions.

By 2009 over 10% of the workforce in Britain and the United States – and more than a third of all graduates – had a postgraduate qualification.

As Oldernotwiser is pointing out: " Trend increases in the relative demand for postgraduates have acted as a key driver of increasing within-graduate inequality and of overall rises in inequality."

melancholly

interesting reading the actual report - although i was irritated that a report by two british writers used the term 'college degree' throughout instead of undergraduate degree!

Oldernotwiser

melancholly wrote: »

interesting reading the actual report - although i was irritated that a report by two british writers used the term 'college degree' throughout instead of undergraduate degree!

At least they didn't use the term "school" in that context.

The_One_Who

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

But the point I was making is that it's only comparatively recently that post grad degrees were required for most of the careers you mention. In the past, an undergraduate degree was at a high enough level to be appropriate but the dumbing down of the educational system now means that post graduate degrees are required.

I don't think it is necessarily a case of dumbing down, probably more of narrowing the application pool. It could also be to do with possible relevant experience that is required, that some Masters courses give.

I do agree with you though about the financial aspects. Postgraduate education isn't really cheap and for the most part requires more work than an undergraduate.