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Unions and Pensions
Comments
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Legal insurance can be cheap when bundled with other insurance- not so much on it's own. But that is part of what union dues are for, to have an advocate in your corner when you decide you need them.0
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worried_jim wrote: »I joined my union about two years ago. .............. It is as if it is being run by chicken lickle and the sky is falling in and is getting to the point where I may leave but I am now paranoid to do so in case the day I do I actually need them. So they have me.
You are typical of some union members, they do not believe in unions but thinks its like an insurance policy in case things go wrong. You spend your time whinging from the sidelines.
Its so easy to attack the union leadership, but a union is its members. Have you ever thought about putting something into it (apart from your subs), standing for election, advocating a change to the way you want your union to behave?Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
There was just a post here a few days ago where a guy was at his sisters work (public service employee) and saw the Union leaflet and flyers saying exactly that- they had to strike because their pensions would be wothless and that they should all opt out and go private.
You saying it does not exist, does not make that man a liar.
I have seen many posters/leaflets in my local hospital in recent weeks. I have seen UNISON and UNITE leaflets that present a very reasonable argument that the changes will make members pensions more expensive and the benefits less. I have not seen a leaflet that says pensions will be worthless.
Of course I cannot say such a leaflet does not exist but if it were in existence as an official TU publication ( which said what you claim it said) I am sure that one would have been published in the Daily Mail by now sent to them by someone like yourself.
The fact is official TU leaflets are usually posted on their websites and are legitimate campaigning documents.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
Not what I claim, but what the OP claimed. and it was a teachers union. But in other cases it was NHS workers saying the same.
Why not go back and check the post, I actually did all the work for you? But of course, you'll call them a liar too.
Keep your head in the sand if you like, but it is going on.0 -
But there is more than one union? And are leafleting etc is done locally as opposed to nationally? There could be variations nationally, and I have no reason not to beleive the poster linked to above, or any of the NHS ones reporting the same behaviour.0
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But there is more than one union?
Yes there is.And are leafleting etc is done locally as opposed to nationally?
Mine is nationally.There could be variations nationally, and I have no reason not to beleive the poster linked to above, or any of the NHS ones reporting the same behaviour.
I would be surprised to see the official leaflets/documents advocating leaving the pension. Much more likely to be over zealous and ill-informed reps. Then again in a lot of cases, it's what the member "thinks" that they are being told and puts their own slant onto things.
The official documents all state the truth, albeit with their own particular bias.0 -
Not what I claim, but what the OP claimed. and it was a teachers union. But in other cases it was NHS workers saying the same.
Why not go back and check the post, I actually did all the work for you? But of course, you'll call them a liar too.
Keep your head in the sand if you like, but it is going on.
No-one other that yourself is calling any one a liar; but many of the posts are second hand (wifes, OHs etc) and others very vague.
Which, of course is exactly why I'm asking for some-one to post up actual documents from a union that advocated leaving the pension.
With, apparently, so many around it wouldn't seem so very difficult.0 -
have a look at post 55:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/48215523#Comment_48215523
This is the latest, but there have been more reports here, incl from the actual workers. All asserting their unions had told them to opt out of their PS pensions. Which in my mind would be illegal for unions to do (as it is for IFAs to do as they can't do better on the open private market).
My only mistake was I thought it was his sister, but was his GF.
Yes I saw the original post. Its impossible to say that a union rep did not say this but it surprises me. First because union reps are usually quite careful not to provide financial advice. But second because (as you say it defies common sense).
If you look on www.teachers.org.uk/ you will find briefing notes for reps addressing meetings about pensions which I suggest most reps would follow. They are freely available to members and the public and nowhere does it make such a claim. Teachers are intelligent people and I find it difficult to believe they would accept such an argument.
The biggest concern in these changes (as I am sure you realise) is that the relatively lower paid who stand to benefit more than the higher paid believe that the pensions are unaffordable to them personally and opt out of the pension.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
There was just a post here a few days ago where a guy was at his sisters work (public service employee) and saw the Union leaflet and flyers saying exactly that- they had to strike because their pensions would be wothless and that they should all opt out and go private.
You saying it does not exist, does not make that man a liar.
Yes I read that.
However sounds very suspect to me. Teachers have union reps in each school - it is an ordinary teacher who volunteers to be the rep. There would ne no need for anyone to come to the school.
Plus why would a Union rep who is trying to get people to support a strike say that the Teachers' Pension scheme is worthless and they should go private. If that was true there would be no need to strike, would there?
Sorry it doesn't add up.0
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