Human Resources and Confidentiality

November5th

I have been having some issues at my job and 3 weeks ago went to see HR for advice. I was a critical of my new manager, he was asking for information I had no access to, and requiring reporting which he did not provide a spec for, leaving me confused. Looking back, it is unfortunate that I questioned his ability with some software or his eyesight, however, I also found he had lied to me about his own dealings with HR, and was annoyed at this. HR offered no solutions, if I couldn't sort it out I should leave. Thsi HR person left the company two weeks later.

In the meantime things improved with the manager, in particular extra efforts on my own part to work out what he wanted and efforts on his part to provide a template. My manager also in this time looking over my shoulder saw an email pop onto my phone with the subject line 'Interview Confirmed' so he knows I have been looking.

In this time, a colleague who has resigned has got into a big fight with HR about working his notice, which HR have decided to resolve by taking him to a disciplinary (weird!) and he now has legal advice. It is known that I am friends with this colleague. I have only been supportive in regards to his distress, I don't agree with the fight he has taken on and advised against it.

On Friday I went to see HR again, I was looking for support and advice on making the things I have achieved more visible and getting training on one of their proprietary systems (no training has been offered to date on any of their systems which has led to many of the initial issues). I wanted to make sure I was doing the best job possible as my probation is up soon.

In response to this HR accused me of being drunk and asked me to leave the premises. I had a mild hangover, trust me on this, but perhaps wine was still on my breath? I did not have breakfast. I believe the use of mouthwash would have fixed this. My partner did not notice any smell. They would have had to send home quite a few people that day if I was the benchmark.

1. Are my previous discussions with HR confidential? I have not seen their notes and have not agreed them.
2. Is this a political attack to ease letting me go?
3. Is resignation first thing Monday the best thing to do? One of the reasons I have been looking for a new job is the systemic difficulty of getting things done and the incredible amount of politics.
4. I believed HR were their to support and advise, what happened has shocked me to the core.

I know I have messed up by going to see HR and being unable to master the politics in the company, I just need to get out with some dignity intact now, whether I can hold on until I find something new, or if I have to resign before I get an unwarranted black mark.

getmore4less

HR are not there for you.

Not good to go moaning to them especialy when the issues are partialy yours.

"Boss, I don't have access to that data, Boss I do not understand what you are asking for".

You should be dealing with your managers.

Other peoples fights with the company are none of your business

Go in Monday and work,
stop moaning to HR,
work with your boss on the issues
play down the oral hygene issue.
stop drinking Sun-Thur
Ignore the leavers issues
hide your personal phone

November5th

Great post and I hope that this is how it works out. I have been very naive, but this is my first corporate.

DVardysShadow

November5th wrote: »

4. I believed HR were their to support and advise, what happened has shocked me to the core.

The truth about HR is that they are a specialist procurement department. You know, the department which purchases stationary and grommets and coiled sheet steel.

So when you have a disagreement with your boss, just imagine that you supply grommets and he supplies stationary and think about how the procurement department would react to being asked to get involved in an argument between the stationary supplier and the grommet supplier. They will consider whether the argument will affect the supply of stationary or grommets and if it appears likely, they will assess the threat to the business form the lack of grommets and the lack of stationary. Then they will decide which can be most easily sourced from elsewhere and which they can least do without.

So never go to HR, there is nothing there for you.

November5th

DVardysShadow wrote: »

The truth about HR is that they are a specialist procurement department. You know, the department which purchases stationary and grommets and coiled sheet steel.

So when you have a disagreement with your boss, just imagine that you supply grommets and he supplies stationary and think about how the procurement department would react to being asked to get involved in an argument between the stationary supplier and the grommet supplier. They will consider whether the argument will affect the supply of stationary or grommets and if it appears likely, they will assess the threat to the business form the lack of grommets and the lack of stationary. Then they will decide which can be most easily sourced from elsewhere and which they can least do without.

So never go to HR, there is nothing there for you.

Why do they bother with the constant stream of posters, leaflets and emails saying 'come talk to us for advice, support and training etc'

persa

November5th wrote: »

I have been having some issues at my job and 3 weeks ago went to see HR for advice. I was a critical of my new manager, he was asking for information I had no access to, and requiring reporting which he did not provide a spec for, leaving me confused. Looking back, it is unfortunate that I questioned his ability with some software or his eyesight, however, I also found he had lied to me about his own dealings with HR, and was annoyed at this. HR offered no solutions, if I couldn't sort it out I should leave. Thsi HR person left the company two weeks later.

In the meantime things improved with the manager, in particular extra efforts on my own part to work out what he wanted and efforts on his part to provide a template. My manager also in this time looking over my shoulder saw an email pop onto my phone with the subject line 'Interview Confirmed' so he knows I have been looking.

In this time, a colleague who has resigned has got into a big fight with HR about working his notice, which HR have decided to resolve by taking him to a disciplinary (weird!) and he now has legal advice. It is known that I am friends with this colleague. I have only been supportive in regards to his distress, I don't agree with the fight he has taken on and advised against it.

On Friday I went to see HR again, I was looking for support and advice on making the things I have achieved more visible and getting training on one of their proprietary systems (no training has been offered to date on any of their systems which has led to many of the initial issues). I wanted to make sure I was doing the best job possible as my probation is up soon.

In response to this HR accused me of being drunk and asked me to leave the premises. I had a mild hangover, trust me on this, but perhaps wine was still on my breath? I did not have breakfast. I believe the use of mouthwash would have fixed this. My partner did not notice any smell. They would have had to send home quite a few people that day if I was the benchmark.

1. Are my previous discussions with HR confidential? I have not seen their notes and have not agreed them.
2. Is this a political attack to ease letting me go?
3. Is resignation first thing Monday the best thing to do? One of the reasons I have been looking for a new job is the systemic difficulty of getting things done and the incredible amount of politics.
4. I believed HR were their to support and advise, what happened has shocked me to the core.

I know I have messed up by going to see HR and being unable to master the politics in the company, I just need to get out with some dignity intact now, whether I can hold on until I find something new, or if I have to resign before I get an unwarranted black mark.

Hi November,

Sorry things haven't been going smoothly in your new job! My opinion is that jumping before being sacked (if this is likely) doesn't really do much to salvage a bad situation, because either way, you end up with a bad reference. In your shoes, I would be inclined to fight the allegation of being drunk on work premises and then leave, if I could find another job.

Presumably you interacted with colleagues that day other than the manager and the HR person? Unless you were swigging from a hipflask on your way to meet HR (unlikely, plus no proof), if several people can attest you weren't drunk first thing in the morning, you weren't drunk when you went to speak to the HR person.

I think it's usual for HR to be involved in recruitment, salary benchmarking, the exit process, etc, but for your everyday training needs, I would expect these to go through your line manager and any grievances to go through your manager's manager (assuming there is one).

getmore4less

One side effect of places that do have issues is people tend to move on leaving vacancies for those that can make it work.

The trick with visiblity is to work at 2level up at least, not much point with your boss or your peers unless they are climbing.

It is much easier for your boss to do pay rises, jutify courses, consider you for opportunities, have youlow down the list for redundacy, if the bosses higher up know who you are.

Depends on the place and work, what you can do to achieve this.

Know what is important to these higher up people and make sure they know it is you that does this work, boss wants a report find out who needs the data and if possible engage them maybe make up a question for clarification. Be at the meetings to stop the boss getting credit or do the presentations and back up the data etc.

In my place I would always be available for the fire fighting jobs coming down the tree, do the travel and make sure the customers were happy so they report back at a senor level.

November5th

persa wrote: »

Hi November,

Sorry things haven't been going smoothly in your new job! My opinion is that jumping before being sacked (if this is likely) doesn't really do much to salvage a bad situation, because either way, you end up with a bad reference. In your shoes, I would be inclined to fight the allegation of being drunk on work premises and then leave, if I could find another job.

Presumably you interacted with colleagues that day other than the manager and the HR person? Unless you were swigging from a hipflask on your way to meet HR (unlikely, plus no proof), if several people can attest you weren't drunk first thing in the morning, you weren't drunk when you went to speak to the HR person.

I think it's usual for HR to be involved in recruitment, salary benchmarking, the exit process, etc, but for your everyday training needs, I would expect these to go through your line manager and any grievances to go through your manager's manager (assuming there is one).

I spoke to the manager that morning and he knows I was not drunk, however HR are now saying they will blame him for not spotting it. This has really led me to think they have an agenda, they are very aggressive. I have put my manager in an awkward spot which I do not like or wish for. They may give him no choice. I am well on my way to getting a new job, ie getting to interview stage more often, but being let go from this one next week will cause problems, which is why resigning seems the bast course of action, I can explain that to future interviewers, although there will be two resignations without something to go to on the CV.
Colleagues have had far worse hangovers and come in smelling of beer, and many have a pint at lunchtime...
The irony is coming from SME's I would never go to HR! I have bought this on myself, I have been stupido!

November5th

getmore4less wrote: »

One side effect of places that do have issues is people tend to move on leaving vacancies for those that can make it work.

The trick with visiblity is to work at 2level up at least, not much point with your boss or your peers unless they are climbing.

It is much easier for your boss to do pay rises, jutify courses, consider you for opportunities, have youlow down the list for redundacy, if the bosses higher up know who you are.

Depends on the place and work, what you can do to achieve this.

Know what is important to these higher up people and make sure they know it is you that does this work, boss wants a report find out who needs the data and if possible engage them maybe make up a question for clarification. Be at the meetings to stop the boss getting credit or do the presentations and back up the data etc.

In my place I would always be available for the fire fighting jobs coming down the tree, do the travel and make sure the customers were happy so they report back at a senor level.

I do think I should had sought more external advice on working at a corporate, like the above! I have found it hard to fit in, even while making many friends across the company. I had no direct management for the first three months, which was why my probation was extended, which freaked me out. I did panic last week about being let go, there is a large churn rate and people are removed for very lame reasons, very quickly. Just wanted to move on in an orderly fashion, finishing up or handing over my projects.
My work has been good, but there is so much politics it doesn't seem to count, and I wonder if I have the mindset to cope with that.

DVardysShadow

November5th wrote: »

Why do they bother with the constant stream of posters, leaflets and emails saying 'come talk to us for advice, support and training etc'

Again, imagine yourself as a grommet supplier. The help advice support and training will be to assist you to be a better grommet supplier. Nothing else.

November5th

DVardysShadow wrote: »

Again, imagine yourself as a grommet supplier. The help advice support and training will be to assist you to be a better grommet supplier. Nothing else.

I have always trained myself too! Moment of madness really, God knows what I was thinking.