Building Regs and Nightmare Conveyancer

cwcw

The vendor of the flat we have been buying for over 4 months did a complete refurbishment of it in order to sell on at profit. However, they did not obtain any building regulations for 2 internal walls removed. 1 of these walls they admit to removing but claim it was a stud wall (the identical flat below has a solid wall there) and the other wall, which has a supporting beam and pillars at either end so is almost certainly structural, the vendor is not admitting to removing. The lease goes back 20 years and on the plans both of these walls are in place. There was 1 previous owner of the lease prior to the vendor. Being an old man who left the place in need of severe modernisation, we find it hard to believe he opted for open plan living, but that's by the by.

We asked for these building regs via our solicitor at the beginning of October. Almost 2 months later, our solicitor sent us all the exchange documentation and a quick one liner about the vendor having no regulations but hey, I arranged an imdemnity policy with them behind your back anyway. We wrote back to the solicitor explaining that this wasn't satisfactory and we wanted retrospective compliance.

Time ticked away until after Christmas and we contacted the solicitor who had still received nothing from the vendor. The solicitor's "pro-active" methods involved simply contacting the vendor's solicitor to ask. We identified the fact that the vendor had altered these walls since the lease was made (the plans are on the lease) and also that in doing so without regulations and freeholder permission the vendor was in breach of the lease. The solicitor had missed these points, as well as the fact the vendor had "accidentally" indicated in the seller's information forms that they were unaware of any alterations to the property. They had also wasted 2 months by arranging imdemnity without even consulting us to see if we were happy first. After all of this, they then billed us an extra £200 for having to deal with this complication, and threatened to charge £120 here after and back charge all work on this same hourly basis if further complications arise (i.e. a blank cheque). We told them to cease work until regulations came through and we would pick it up again from exchange. We decided we could chase the vendor ourselves rather than pay someone so incompetant £120 an hour to do so.

We did this via the estate agent. The vendor is insisting no regulations are needed because only a stud wall was removed. They even wanted us to pay a structural engineer to go round and inspect their work. We spoke to a structural engineer who advised me there was no way we should be paying for it and it is up to the owner to sort it out. We contacted the estate agent and told them we couldn't move forwards until they sorted it, which is where we're at now. It seemed to put them on the back foot a bit, but we will see.

The way we see it is that a supporting wall(s) needs to be done properly. Imdemnity insurance is ok to a point, but no good if the roof collapses while we're doing the washing up. We seem to have a useless conveyancer and a vendor who just wants a quick buck and is not willing to accept responsibility for their oversight. We're also worried that if they're so reluctant to apply retrospectively, perhaps they know what kind of standard they did the work to. As you can imagine this has caused us much stress - we thought we'd be in by Xmas, but a chainless purchase has gone well beyond 4 months now. Also if our solicitor had consulted us all those months ago, we could have got the issue resolved by now, either by having completed or by pulling out at less expense than we have now incurred. It feels like the solicitor is working for the vendor and not us - again, they're just after their money.

What does everyone else think? It would be interesting to have some views from a neutral perspective. All our friends'/family's views are helpful but they're always going to be biased.

spunkeyrich

How badly do you want the property. If your willing to do so see if you can go halves on the structual enginneers report. They are about £250.00 the vendor maybe right in that it was not a supporting wall, unless he was a cowboy he would have checked that out beforehand. it doesnt matter if it was stud or brick, the thing is if it was supporting or if he put a lintell up.

Home buying can be a right pain but you have to judge wether this one is worth going for.

cheers

rich

mrsc_4

As someone else said have a full structual report if you are concerned and REALLY want the property? What was picked up in your home buyers report or survey?

marybishop

Wonder what the freeholder thinks about all of this - has anyone had feedback from him/her/them to find out what their opinion is? Most leases state that internal alterations are not to be undertaken without the permission of the freeholder.

cwcw

Yes, they did breach the lease, but the management company don't seem bothered.

We do really want it, but we don't see why we should have to pay for an engineer to do what the seller should have done from the start. We're already paying over the asking price for the property.

We're also annoyed with our solicitor - do we have any chance of complaining and getting some money back? Or are they as useless as this as standard?

Another way forward we are considering, since the vendor is in such a rush to avoid building regs (which has ironically made the sale drag on longer than it would if he had just got them) is lowering our offer by a few thousand to proceed without the regs/permission and sort it all out after we move in. We then have a few thousand to play with to get an engineer out to inspect, get a builder to put anything right that needs doing, and clearing up the mess afterwards. Having said that, we have no idea how much a correction would cost, e.g. if a whole new beam was required.

marybishop

Why not get the advice of a Chartered Building Surveyor. If you contact the RICS https://www.rics.org, go to 'Find a Surveyor' and phone one in your area who could give you some advice as to what to do. They should be willing to have a telephone discussion free of charge to advise you on what to do next.

ab7167

Two points to add:-
a) Removal of a stud wall may require building regulations if it is part of the fire escape route for the house.
b) Idemnity policies are often not worth the paper they are written on, and I would be very, very, very careful to check the exclusions before accpeting this.

cwcw

marybishop wrote:

Why not get the advice of a Chartered Building Surveyor. If you contact the RICS https://www.rics.org, go to 'Find a Surveyor' and phone one in your area who could give you some advice as to what to do. They should be willing to have a telephone discussion free of charge to advise you on what to do next.

We did, and his advice was that it wasn't our responsibility - the vendor should sort out the building regulations as he has broken the law and the lease by carrying out work without first getting a certificate. This is the deadlock we have now reached.

cwcw

ab7167 wrote:

Two points to add:-
a) Removal of a stud wall may require building regulations if it is part of the fire escape route for the house.
b) Idemnity policies are often not worth the paper they are written on, and I would be very, very, very careful to check the exclusions before accpeting this.

Thanks - I don't think (a) is relevant but (b) certainly is - we didn't want the imdemnity policy and never did. Our solicitor arranged this behind our back without consultation, and wasted nearly 2 months doing so, which is why we wondered if we have any chance of complaining successfully against our solicitor.

lotto-dreamer

....which is why we wondered if we have any chance of complaining successfully against our solicitor....

The Law Society refers to this site regarding complaints - it might give you some idea of what to do

http://www.legalcomplaints.org.uk/home.page

marybishop

Have you threatened to pull out? I would seriously think about walking away from this one as it sounds like you could be walking into a minefield. Hard I know as you've obviously incurred fees but the worry is how much money could you be shelling out once the property is yours? I would also definitely get some advice on how to make a complaint against your solicitor for their handling of the whole matter - they're supposed to be acting for you, not the other side, perhaps they need reminding of this.