When is a conviction "spent"?

RobertoMoir

jamespir wrote: »

why should it if they are the best person for the job and why should there be any risk

not everyones a repeat offender

And I guess the idea behind a conviction being spent after 5 years is that if you go 5 years without doing it again then people can actually have some confidence that a person isn't a repeat offender.

I believe in second chances and rehabilitation. I also believe that employers have the right to pick and choose. how do you balance that?

abi-em-mum83

unholyangel wrote: »

My old neighbour was in jail years ago. He had similar problems when he got out. A lot of people turned their backs on him but i didnt as he'd always looked after me (i was a young girl living on her own, if he heard screams - usually from me babysitting my little cousins and having a laugh with them - he'd come to my door to make sure everything was ok).

He managed to find work at a charity shop. Started out on a volunteer basis then got taken on as paid staff.

Does she have a case/social worker of any kind? Could she perhaps ask at the jobcentre if they have any special advisors that could help? Has she spoken to the jobcentre about whether she's suitable for a work trial? Or whether they have any work placements available for her?

It may involve working for a little while with little or no money but if she is willing to try hard, there will be an employer out there who will trust her. You never know, perhaps the employer has had a conviction themselves and can empathise!

She could also ask around small local businesses as they are probably less likely to do a criminal background check.

I dont believe in crucifying someone for a mistake. We've all made them, just on varying degrees. As the saying goes, let he without sin cast the first stone! (and technically by casting the first stone they'd be committing a sin even if they hadnt already )

Hi thanks all for your comments, its certainly been refreshing to relay these messages back to her, while not what she had been hoping to hear shes glad it hasnt turned into a personal attack! I have told her to go out to her high street and hand out cvs, personally I think if she meets potential employers face to face she may have more chance than an anonymous online application. She had a very disappointing phone call with her local job centre this afternoon who basically said they had no help available. There are currently no schemes available she could be considered for (apparently she was told there were very few work trials in her area, and there are more "suitable" people to be considered, those without unspent convictions!). She couldnt work for nothing because she would need to cover childminders costs, which would be paid from working tax credits and you must be working 16 hours minimum to receive this.
I have suggested party plan but this again is not suitable as she has no evening/weekend childcare which is when most partyplan is centred. She has an idea for a business (to do with photography) but is completely clueless as to how she would set it up, and couldnt afford the initial outlay (something I have no idea about either so couldnt advise).
I feel Im limited in how much worthwhile advice I can give as Im not the most knowledgable of people! But massive thanks for everyone taking the time to post!!

TheSaint_2

Maybe the main issue here is that she is applying for retail jobs which will involve handling money.

You could try applying for call center jobs, bakeries, office work etc.
All the jobs I have ever applied for have never had any questions asked about criminal records etc.

as an aside Jamespir - you are way over-reacting. Try re-reading the post that got you mad. Then read it again as you clearly don't understand english very well.

Gavin83

jamespir wrote: »

why should it if they are the best person for the job and why should there be any risk

not everyones a repeat offender

True not everyone will offend again. However I do believe it adds to a persons character and businesses should be allowed to consider it in an application, if they choose to ignore it is up to them.

I think the current system is fair, if the person can stay out of trouble for 5 years then they no longer have to declare it. I'd question what sort of lesson it would send out if they were practically allowed to ignore their convictions after a few months.

pulliptears

Voluntary work is always useful to fill gaps on CV's, and can often lead to full time work. My lad worked voluntary for an old man in a book shop when he was 16, he'd turn up on a sunday and help with the lifting etc. The result was a glowing reference and him becoming the youngest employee the local mobile phone call center has ever had. He's still there now nearly 3 years later, they are so pleased with him they even changed all his hours to fit around Uni.

Even if your friend can only do something for a couple of hours over a weekend if it gets her a good character reference it's worth her while. Perhaps you or another friend could offer to look after her children for a few hours to help?

abi-em-mum83

pulliptears wrote: »

Voluntary work is always useful to fill gaps on CV's, and can often lead to full time work. My lad worked voluntary for an old man in a book shop when he was 16, he'd turn up on a sunday and help with the lifting etc. The result was a glowing reference and him becoming the youngest employee the local mobile phone call center has ever had. He's still there now nearly 3 years later, they are so pleased with him they even changed all his hours to fit around Uni.

Even if your friend can only do something for a couple of hours over a weekend if it gets her a good character reference it's worth her while. Perhaps you or another friend could offer to look after her children for a few hours to help?

Unfortunately I live at the opposite side of the country to her, she has no other friends, she has told me that due to an abusive relationship, and the conviction, she has been left without any friends in the small town where she lives. She recently asked a mum at the nursery her eldest attends if she could babysit for approx 2 hours while she received a colonoscopy but the mum was unwilling to watch both under 5's, and she had to take them with her to her appointment! Im chatting to her just now, today she called her local VSA and her childs nursery school but VSA have nothing and the school requires help in the afternoons but that would mean putting the children at childminder that she'd have to apy for out of her own pocket. Not possible on her benefits.

She is not looking at JUST retail but I have recently helped her update and rejig her cv and retail is all she really has experience in! She is basically applying for everything at the minute though, she says she spent a small fortune in stamps this morning!!pmsl.

unholyangel

I actually overheard a conversation at the jobcentre this afternoon.

The guy was told that if he was on a work trial/voluntary basis, they would fund childcare costs but once he received actual payment for working, it would come off WTC. Might be worth looking into?

What about registering with agencies? I attended a interview yesterday with one who were recruiting on behalf of amazon, called back this afternoon to find out how i'd gotten on and they said my interview had went well and i should receive a phone call from them within a few days (so fingers crossed that i'll be offered the position! i'm not counting my chickens).

She would likely still have to declare her conviction to the agency but they would then be able to still offer her positions which wouldnt be affected.

She could also try volunteering for her local Citizens Advice or hospital, even a few hours a week while her kids are at nursery.

She could also look into education/training courses. In scotland we have ILA scotland that give you £200 or £500 towards courses every year. I'm planning to redo my first aid course (been about 10 years since i held a certificate so dont think refresher would be possible) this year and next year in february start towards a masters in accounting.

If she has something like first aid under her belt, it may just make her more attractive to employers than the others applying. Alternatively, if she's a student by the time she's finished training, her conviction may be spent, she'll be trained in a particular field and she should receive help with childcare costs while studying. Or she could even do it from home while the kids are sleeping! Theres open college/universities that do this and a lot of courses dont require formal qualifications to enrol.

She could perhaps even volunteer at her local nursery.

I'm not saying its going to be easy. But perhaps if she starts thinking "outside the box" she might have more luck

EDIT: oh and as for her own business, she should do some research. There are places that offer grants for starting up costs. Some need to be repaid and others dont. Not sure whats offered south of the border tbh but its always worth checking!