Brakes need replacing 2 days after buying car from dealership

bjblackmore

Hi,

We've just part exchanged our old car for a 2nd hand ex-motability Volvo v50 from a dealership (Motorparks).

Before we picked up the car, it was meant to have been serviced, and they have stamped the log book. However, while driving the car on Friday I thought the breaks felt a little spongy, so I booked it in at Kwik Fit for one of their free brake checks, and they have come back and said that it needs new brake disks on the front wheels, the front and rear pads are on an advisory, and the brake fluid was too low to measure. All in all, Kwik Fit have quoted around £400 to replace everything.

However, I want to know where I stand with the dealership!? Shouldn't this have been picked up, and sorted during the service, especially the brake fluid? The car came with a 3 month guarantee, which we also upgraded to 12 month warranty. I know brakes are considered wear & tear, but I'm sure the car shouldn't have been sold with worn brakes & low brake fluid. I also think they gave the car an MOT & passed it, after they purchased it from the previous owner, as the MOT certificate is from end of July this year, and we know they've had it on their forecourt for at least 3 months. So if it passed an MOT, and has only been sat on their forecourt, it shouldn't have had any more wear n' tear to the brake disks/pads.

I went straight back over to the dealership, and spoke with the sales guy who sold me the car, but he seemed just to wash his hands of it, and said he wasn't a mechanic, so couldn't comment, and suggested I book it in with the service department tomorrow. When I asked if that meant they were going to pay he said he didn't know and I'd have to talk to the service dept manager.

I really don't feel that I should have to pay out £400 on a car I've only had for 2 days, because the dealership didn't do the service/MOT correctly. Can anyone give me any advise on where I stand?

Many thanks

Ben

poppasmurf_bewdley

In the first instance, take it to a garage you know has a decent reputation and get a second opinion (preferably in writing).

Kwik Fit would tell you a brand new car with five miles on the clock needed new brakes if they thought they could get away with it. I'm surprised they didn't tell you it needed new tyres and shock absorbers as well!

If they confirm the first diagnosis, then go straight back to the selling dealership with the report and tell them they have sold you a car which is not road worthy/fit for purpose, which is illegal. A decent dealership will know what to do next. A shyster will try and fob you off (which it sounds like you may have).

motorguy

bjblackmore wrote: »

Hi,

We've just part exchanged our old car for a 2nd hand ex-motability Volvo v50 from a dealership (Motorparks).

Before we picked up the car, it was meant to have been serviced, and they have stamped the log book. However, while driving the car on Friday I thought the breaks felt a little spongy, so I booked it in at Kwik Fit for one of their free break checks, and they have come back and said that it needs new break disks on the front wheels, the front and rear pads are on an advisory, and the break fluid was too low to measure. All in all, Kwik Fit have quoted around £400 to replace everything.

However, I want to know where I stand with the dealership!? Shouldn't this have been picked up, and sorted during the service, especially the break fluid? The car came with a 3 month guarantee, which we also upgraded to 12 month warranty. I know breaks are considered wear & tear, but I'm sure the car shouldn't have been sold with worn breaks & low break fluid. I also think they gave the car an MOT & passed it, after they purchased it from the previous owner, as the MOT certificate is from end of July this year, and we know they've had it on their forecourt for at least 3 months. So if it passed an MOT, and has only been sat on their forecourt, it shouldn't have had any more wear n' tear to the break disks/pads.

I went straight back over to the dealership, and spoke with the sales guy who sold me the car, but he seemed just to wash his hands of it, and said he wasn't a mechanic, so couldn't comment, and suggested I book it in with the service department tomorrow. When I asked if that meant they were going to pay he said he didn't know and I'd have to talk to the service dept manager.

I really don't feel that I should have to pay out £400 on a car I've only had for 2 days, because the dealership didn't do the service/MOT correctly. Can anyone give me any advise on where I stand?

Many thanks

Ben

KwikFit are NOTORIOUS for recommending a massive amount of work.

If the brakes werent grinding or juddering its unlikely they need this work - though they may be 'close' to needing the work.

Let the dealership have a look and see what they say. If you're not happy with their response, find a local garage and have them have check them. Or maybe an AA report?

bjblackmore

Hi,

Thanks for the quick replies.

Actually Kwik Fit did say the 2 rear tyres would need replacing soon, however I wouldn't ever use them, firstly because they aren't very 'kwik' - spent 2 hours waiting for them to fit 2 tyres last time - and secondly as they quoted £100 for each tyre, when I know I can get someone like e-tyres to come out to my work, and fit the same tyres for £65 each.

The brakes weren't grinding or juddering, but I did find that when you put you foot on the brake it was very spongy, you have to put your foot all the way down before they seem to kick in. Although I was comparing it to our previous car, a 2.2 TDCi Mondeo, which had very sharp brakes, and you only had to tap the brakes. I thought it might just be a difference in manufactures, but I wanted to get it checked out, just in case.

I do have AA membership, so I might try an AA report, as I think I get a discount. I'm not sure they are any reputable garages around Swindon, last one we took my wifes car to, did something when they were fitting the timing belt and blew all the valves...

System

poppasmurf_bewdley wrote: »

they have sold you a car which is not road worthy/fit for purpose, which is illegal.

There is nothing in what the OP has said that implies that the car is not roadworthy.

Disks may be scored but within limits. This can easily cause the spongy feeling. Low brake fluid, although not a good idea, does not make the car unroadworthy.

poppasmurf_bewdley

!!!!!! wrote: »

There is nothing in what the OP has said that implies that the car is not roadworthy.

Disks may be scored but within limits. This can easily cause the spongy feeling. Low brake fluid, although not a good idea, does not make the car unroadworthy.

The Op says Kwik Fit found the brakes were worn, it needs new brake discs, and brake fluid could not be measured. Those three faults denote an unroadworthy car - would you drive it on the road with those faults? I wouldn't.

Low brake fluid can lead to complete brake failure if it's losing fluid because of a leak or split in a pipe or a worn seal.

The one thing you do not leave to chance on a car are the brakes, and any garage worth its salt knows that.

pendulum

bjblackmore wrote: »

... so I booked it in at Kwik Fit for one of their free brake checks

There's a reason why these brake checks are "free". It's to get you in then recommend as much work as possible. The "mechanics" are on commission so will try every trick in the book. I wouldn't even be surprised if the brake fluid level was acceptable and he just said it was nearly dry just to scare you in to not driving away and getting the work done there and then.

If you're worried, take it to a proper garage for a second opinion, saying nothing about your Kwik Fit experience. If they diagnose exactly the same problems then fair enough.

cajef

Cannot quite work out why the OP took the car to Kwik Fit when they had only had the car two days, as there was a twelve month warranty why not go straight back to the dealer and give them a chance to sort it out.

System

poppasmurf_bewdley wrote: »

The Op says Kwik Fit found the brakes were worn, .

If they were dangerous why only an advisory? Brakes can be worn with making the car unroadworthy. If the pad material is close to the legal minimum then they are worn and not illegal!

harveybobbles

OP - why didn't you take the car back to the dealer with your concerns?

Also, the car could have been sat on the forecourt for a week or so and the discs have gathereda bit of surface rust which will clean off after a bit of use.

Weird_Nev

poppasmurf_bewdley wrote: »

The Op says Kwik Fit found the brakes were worn, it needs new brake discs, and brake fluid could not be measured. Those three faults denote an unroadworthy car - would you drive it on the road with those faults? I wouldn't.

The moment you apply new brakes for the first time, they're "worn". That's what they do. They orperate by friction. Kwik fit make their money by saying "your brakes are 60% Worn" which sounds terrible, like they're only working with 40% efficiency. What they could say is "Your brakes stil lhave 20,000 miles left on them" which would be true in most cases. Not so scary now.
Scored discs? A function of slowing a spinning metal disc by applying a friction compound in all weathers, and subject to road grime. It is of no consequence. It actually increases the friction area between discs and pad.
Brake fluid not measured? Well, the brakes are still working so there must be some! The OP can check this for themselves in a moment. Find the Brake fluid reservoir, pop the top off and have a look. You should see some fluid down there. If there's not you can top it up as a temporary measure, but I would prefer to take it direct to a garage for them to do a fluid flush and bleed. Cars don't actually lose brake fluid unless there is a fault, and generally if that is the case you know all too soon. "Too low to measure" sounds like Kwik fit speak for "Couldn't be bothered to check" to me.

poppasmurf_bewdley wrote: »

Low brake fluid can lead to complete brake failure if it's losing fluid because of a leak or split in a pipe or a worn seal.

This is true, and if the car did indeed have no fluid visible in the reservior I'd be checking calipers and hoses carefully for any signs of fluid leakage. But generally, if it's losing fluid in that manner it's abundantly apparent, the pedal goes to the floor and you have almost no braking effect.


So lets not scare monger and feel all self important, eh?

OP:
Get a proper garage to report on the condition of the brakes. You want a %age worn and a disc thickness compared to minimum allowable (i.e. 22mm (min 20mm)). If they are absolutely on their last legs, so much so that a garage would have been negligent to miss it, then I think you'd be entitled to some goodwill if the seller claimed to have inpected and serviced it. But brakes wear, and really you should expect to replace them at some point. It probably won't be urgent, so just budget for it when the service shedule comes around.

Here are some brake pads that passed an MOT about a week before I replaced them:
The brakes were still absolutely fine.