Looking for an IFA - I will pay 5% maybe 10%!

dunstonh

So whu shoud the wealth management industry be any different?

Because no-one can promise you anything. You are investing in something on the basis of future potential and long term growth. You appear to want short term bonuses and are disregarding the fact it is potential but want guarantees effectively.

gadgetmind

dunstonh wrote: »

Because no-one can promise you anything.

No, because the word "promise" has been craftily replaced by "illustration"; not a pretty picture.

bigfreddiel

so what have we learn't so far

1 ifas only offer advice not management - obvious really - its in the name

2 the advice comes with no guarantee - well i guess they do tell us this in the form of "past performance is no indicator for future performance" and so on

3 ifas have access to financial products that the layman doesn't - so thats why you should use them or at least its one reason

4 ifas are only out for themselves and their commission or fees

i believe ifas should be held accountabe for bad advice and i'm sure dunstohn will tell me they are through some ombudsman or other but its a closed shop so they all stickup for each other so you won't get anywhere

after all you wouldn't employ someone to do a job and they said something like "this is what i'm going to do but i'm not offering any guarantees and i may not turn up to work next week but i still expect to be paid".

you just wouldn't consider them for the job would you!

cheers

fj

bigfreddiel

gadgetmind wrote: »

No, because the word "promise" has been craftily replaced by "illustration"; not a pretty picture.

exactly - see my last post - we, the general public are actually to blame by believing their well crafted sales pitch and being blinded by figures charts and so on - when I questioned an ifa about the principles behind the various risk profiles he could not or would not answer - when I queried his fees he got even more defensive and then aggresive.

and don't even mention how he treated my wife - she was just "the little woman who made the tea" and "here's an illustration you may understand"

he was shown the door after i lost two hours of my life which i will never get back

cheers

fj

ruperts

Did your wife cheat on you with an IFA? It would explain why you would be harbouring this silly bitterness towards them.

bigfreddiel

ruperts wrote: »

Did your wife cheat on you with an IFA? It would explain why you would be harbouring this silly bitterness towards them.

that gave me the best laugh all week - i don't hold any bitterness towards ifas i just asked a few simple questions and all i got a vetry ngative response

and if its silly to ask how he justified fees of £10k+ is silly then call me the big chief of silliness :j

cheers

fj

Aegis

bigfreddiel wrote: »

so what have we learn't so far

1 ifas only offer advice not management - obvious really - its in the name

True enough. Some will offer a more regular review service designed for more frequent rebalancing, but ultimately they're delegating the day to day management to a fund manager )or to the market itself if they select a tracker for you).

2 the advice comes with no guarantee - well i guess they do tell us this in the form of "past performance is no indicator for future performance" and so on

The advice is usually along the lines of "this is the asset allocation I recommend you adopt based on your risk profile, age and goals". The advice is "guaranteed" by the Ombudsman to a degree, in that if it is deemed unsuitable you will be able to claim restitution for losses you may encounter as a result of bad advice or implementation, but the only way you can get guaranteed returns is to use guaranteed products (e.g. cash accounts or guaranteed equity products of some sort). Most of these come with either very low returns or some kind of counterparty risk that must be accepted in lieu of investment risk.

3 ifas have access to financial products that the layman doesn't - so thats why you should use them or at least its one reason

Some, yes. They can also access the same products as retail consumers but at better rates for products like annuities or insurance. As such, these products can often be obtained at a lower cost even factoring in the advice, as long as a pure commission option isn't selected by the client.

4 ifas are only out for themselves and their commission or fees

Many IFAs do pro bono work on top of their normal business. Even ignoring this, everyone ultimately works for their own benefit, so it's hardly a bad thing to be interested in generating business.

i believe ifas should be held accountabe for bad advice and i'm sure dunstohn will tell me they are through some ombudsman or other but its a closed shop so they all stickup for each other so you won't get anywhere

You might be interested to read through some threads on Citywire where IFAs bemoan the fact that the FSA and FOS are largely staffed by people who have never given any advice. As such, it's a far cry from being a closed shop and in actual fact is closer to being TWO closed shops: one for the IFAs and one for the regulators, who are often appointed from the big banks...

after all you wouldn't employ someone to do a job and they said something like "this is what i'm going to do but i'm not offering any guarantees and i may not turn up to work next week but i still expect to be paid".

You're paying for the advice and the implementation. If you receive both, you should pay for the service.

You aren't paying for specific investment returns unless you agree those separately, and as indicated above this is unlikely to be agreed to by any IFAs.

bigfreddiel

Aegis wrote: »

True enough. Some will offer a more regular review service designed for more frequent rebalancing, but ultimately they're delegating the day to day management to a fund manager )or to the market itself if they select a tracker for you).

aegis - good response and you certainly answered all my points - cheers

interestingly enough in this weeks IC Moira O'Neill states that ifas manage billions of pounds of money - so they do offer more than advice!

and your golden rules should be mandatory for all investors

qpop

bigfreddiel - I wonder if you could help me, I'm looking for a doctor.

The thing is I've got a really healthy body, and it only seems to make sense to me that a doctor should guarantee good, in fact, improving health.

I'm happy to pay the doctor handsomely for every year my health improves, and I really do feel if the doctor is worth his salt this should be the case.

God forbid the doctor allows me to become unhealthy, well, he'd better compensate me for my troubles, after all, what am I paying him for otherwise?!.


I'll just be grabbing my coat...

bigfreddiel

qpop wrote: »

bigfreddiel - I wonder if you could help me, I'm looking for a doctor.

The thing is I've got a really healthy body, and it only seems to make sense to me that a doctor should guarantee good, in fact, improving health.

I'm happy to pay the doctor handsomely for every year my health improves, and I really do feel if the doctor is worth his salt this should be the case.

God forbid the doctor allows me to become unhealthy, well, he'd better compensate me for my troubles, after all, what am I paying him for otherwise?!.


I'll just be grabbing my coat...

interesting twist on my conjecture - i wonder what the stats show private vs nhs?