Can I - and should I - claim on this?

tahrey

As noted in another thread, I was involved in YET ANOTHER stupid accident last night, where someone who wasn't paying attention ran into me. The back end of my car is damaged, enough to make it temporarily undriveable until I can hack the bumper and mudguards about, maybe enough to fail MOT. Got the details of the other party, sort of. Might be false, I wasn't in much of a position to check.

However, the car is already a class-C writeoff that the insurers paid out on, and I never did get the previous (cosmetic only) damage fixed because it was completely not worth it.

So, can I even make a claim any more? Particularly for replacement, if it's an MOT fail because of possible frame damage? And certainly for whatever it might take to make it driveable again?

Could really do with not having it on my previous accident record either because it might make it difficult to get thru comparison sites, just because of the sheer number of hits I've taken in the last 5 years. I suppose I have to report it all the same, though?

Any tips gladly received... thanks

Quentin

You do need to report the incident, (and leave yourself open to all sorts of problems if you don't - the third party will be reporting it anyway, so your insurer will find out!)

But you don't have to claim off your own insurer - report it "for information only", then pursue the third party.

You say your car is not roadworthy now, so a claim handler would be very interested in looking after this (including a replacement car whilst yours is repaired/written off)!

InsideInsurance

Your car will still have a value even if it has already been declared a total loss. Obviously both the previous total loss and the pre-existing damage will impact its valuation which may mean that when you net off the salvage value (assuming your still wanting to keep it) then the settlement may be tiny or non-existent. If it is now a Cat A or B then unless you have the necessary licenses it will go to a breakers yard and so the salvage wouldnt be netted off.

tahrey

Quentin:
Well, when I say unroadworthy ... it's an 11 year old Megane which has some pretty obvious denting all up the passenger side front wing and door, scrappy paintwork all over, all four arches rusting with the paint flaked off (it was only ever intended as a scrappy stop-gap, so I didn't waste time and money scrubbing, de-rusting, primering, top coating etc - all the whilst not driving it to keep dirt off - like I did with previous cars), and the less critical mechanical bits partly held together with duct-tape and hairclips (I'm not exaggerating here). The most valuable parts are likely the spare wheel, speakers off the stereo system, and brand-new alternator. I bought it for a grand in January 2009. A claims handler would drop it like a dog egg...

Add to that now, the rear bumper being pushed forward just enough at the rear left so the mudguard rubs loudly on the tyre as you go along. I got home OK at 15-20mph but didn't want to risk higher speeds (shredding of tyre, heat build up, possible lock-up or pseudo suspension collapse if I hit a big bump and it got jammed).

I reckon if I jack it, take the wheel off, remove the arch liner and token-gesture mudflap, and optionally set-to with a mallet, bit of wood and an old pipe as a makeshift drift, I might be able to free it up enough to struggle on at least until MOT; if by some miracle it passes that, then once 2012 arrives and/or it passes 101,000 miles (the point at which the latest repair has effectively cost 10p/mile), I have no qualms about scrapping it, as I was going to do that anyway. I'm more bothered about having to take time out that I don't have, looking for a replacement vehicle (if it's written off, which it almost certainly would be... they wrote it off once already for the front-end cosmetic-only panel damage that's less severe than the dent the rear quarter has just received, and this time there's identifiable deformation of the chassis - inconsequential, as it's outboard of the rear wheels, doesn't prevent the boot from shutting and doesn't affect the light cluster alignment, but it's still bent), when I really wanted to leave all that crap until the new year if possible, when I'll have a bit more free time.

The third party was Joe Q Random-Workman in an unmarked company-owned (apparently) Transit Connect that didn't even have a spare wheel (poor silly !!!!!! was facing a 5-mile drive at walking pace to avoid ruining the rim), and apart from the blowout it didn't seem to have suffered any identifiable damage. Given the way he completely lost it on a surface where my mid-range tyres still had plenty left to give, I suspect they may just hand it off to their local greasemonkey to have a(nother) partworn chinese budget tyre fitted for £15 all-in... and make him pay for it

Still, I'll let them know it happened. Problem is, Aviva don't let on at any point what incidents I have on file, so at this point - including a windscreen chip repair and a new window fitted following a break-in - I may be up to 6 events in the last 5 years, which is bad news even if they're non-claim. But I don't know, do I, because it's impossible to keep track

Inside Insurance:
That's sort of why I want to keep it. They actually gave me a pretty good settlement before, which I've been trying to hang onto (virtually, at least - though I'm alright now and could stand to spend a couple grand on a replacement, at points in the last few months it's been the only thing keeping me within my fee-free overdraft limit), so I doubt I'd get anything back. An assessment would probably come back Class B I think, marginal class C if the boot floor can be flattened out again.

As, practically speaking, I need something a touch smaller (or at least, narrower!) and more frugal, the plan was - may still be - to keep an eye on possible replacements, and when the next major thing went wrong (hopefully in 2012!), to give up on it... pull any reasonably resaleable parts off it (silly cosmetic wing, alloy wheels with decent tyres, battery, alt, etc), replacing them with scrap alternatives where necessary to make it tow-able, and then dropping it off at the local [strike]scrapyard[/strike] metal recyclers (ahem) to see what a tonne's worth of steel and glass is worth these days. If it was salvaged as part of the deal, I figure I'd be very lucky to see even the latter amount in full.

Quentin

tahrey wrote: »

Quentin:
Well, when I say unroadworthy ... .

From what you say the accident has made it unroadworthy which is why a claim handler would be interested! (Think car hire till the third party has agreed the write off!)

tahrey

To be honest I didn't have that good an experience when I last made use of an insurer-provided courtesy car... the thing I received was certainly plush, but not particularly well-suited, and I had to pay out the CDW out of my own pocket and wait months - literally - before getting it back, AFTER having to waste a lot of time on phone calls arguing it out (luckily I could use the workplace line...) that, no, the policy does actually say I'm covered for it.

Later found out it cost like a grand for a couple week's hire (or in other words: slightly more than I actually got back from the writing-off and salvaging of my previous car, even after the excess was recovered, and roughly as much as I then paid for its replacement), paid without murmur by the insurer (and then they haggle over 90 quid!). How much has that put everyone's premiums up by? I could have got something from easycar for about one fifty! Or just grabbed a random ebay scummer then sold it on. Worse, it was a diesel, but somehow got slightly worse economy than my written-off petrol car, so I was paying more in fuel driving it than I would have if I'd done a bit more patching-up with duct tape and foregone the courtesy car, just asking the salvage guys to wait until I'd secured a replacement.

In any case, I don't think I'd get much if it was written off (again). They may offer me the salvage price, plus a few quid more if I'm lucky - but I'm not 100% sure that, given that it's been written off and paid out on before, I'd get anything at all. That's really one of the questions I could do with an answer to.

Either way I reckon I'd be as well to ask the local scrappie what they'd give me for it (you actually can get cash for them again, these days, now the price of metal's gone up, right?), and particularly so if I wouldn't get any comeback otherwise. Until then, I'd prefer to hammer the rear quarter back into a usable shape, get six weeks' more use out of it (more, if it passes MOT! may have to ask a local test centre if they'd give it a once-over and advise), whilst looking for a replacement at my leisure, rather than having this one summarily collected by a salvage agent and trying to fit the hunt around the 101 other post-house-move things I have to figure out. Haven't had chance to check over my contents insurance documents yet, !!!!!!... might miss the cooling-off period then find it's unsuitable!

Never mind, then...

tahrey

Right, I've got it back in driveable condition, but... would this be an MOT fail, or not? Because if it is, I need to start looking for a replacement sooner rather than later.

Wheel off, bit of work with a star-bit screwdriver and an 11mm hex socket and that's the arch liner and mudguard away... pried the bumper past the bent metal into a better position with a hammer and chisel and a bit of brute force and ignorance... Car is now driveable again (there's only about a centimetre's clearance, but that's enough, and it seems to stay fairly constant when an accomplice forcefully bounces the rear suspension) and seemed to remain in good shape to distinctly inefficient speeds, though I think some fumes were coming in through the gap in the boot seal... will have to keep the windows open!

However, couldn't straighten the wing/frame/whatever it is with my household DIY spec hammer and wood block, the exhaust silencer has a broken hanger (possibly fixable at home?) so the tailpipe is resting on the bumper (doesn't seem to get hot enough to cause melt damage or any fire risk), the door and boot don't close or re-open all that cleanly (though, gap in the rubber seal excepted, they do shut securely with a hearty slam, and, after pre-application of a lot of WD40, pop open in a satisfactory manner), and the underseal has torn over what looks like a weld seam in the wheel arch, although the metal is still sound despite the obvious bend. Could maybe hide the latter problem by replacing the arch liner, if it doesn't then end up rubbing on the tyre.

I'll ask the insurers how much I'd be likely to get if I claimed, vs what a scrapyard would give me, but I don't need to bug them for a courtesy car or anything like that at least... if there's nothing much in it, particularly as there'd be cocking about with solicitors to get my excess back (£200 IIRC - significant if I'd only get 250-300 quid), it doesn't seem worth wrecking someone's claim record and putting everyones premiums up slightly for it, much as it'd prove a useful lesson along the lines of "don't tailgate and text, idiot".

vaio

An old vectra I know got rear-ended and written off twice in 18 months, both times he kept the salvage and carried on using the car. He got £1400 the first time and £1100 the second time so I'd guess that previous cat c status doesn't make a whole lot of difference on old (tatty?) cars.

I'd be tempted to ring the TP insurance, explain that you would generally prefer not to involve a claims handling/credit hire firm but need it resolved quickly as you need a car for work and yours is borderline unroadworthy. I wouldn't be surprised if they offered you £700, maybe a grand to make you go away (and avoid the credit hire costs).

as for your previous "incidents", I'd guess they will all be recorded on the CUE database and for £10 you can get a copy of everything recorded against you.

tahrey

Interesting ... I'm not even 100% sure how I'd go about what you say, but it could be handy. Certainly, I wouldn't deny I could do with the cash in general terms, however flush I might temporarily be before having to replace this car. Even half what I've registered its worth as, minus the excess, would be a useful bonus.

All the same, I have had the full value of mine paid already (even considering the sum was "minus salvage"), and as I say - although some of the money was supposed to go into repairing the damage, I didn't figure it was going to be worth it, because I'm completely unfussed by the cosmetic appearance and as an 11-year-old write-off the car has very little resale value regardless of how much I might tart it up. Ergo with the old damage still in place and no receipts for any repair work, might my insurers start asking what the devil I'm getting up to, here?

Or is there actually no obligation on me to do anything in particular with the money once it's been paid?

It's not 100% certain either way whether it'll be an instant MOT fail, or squeak by, so I'll have to ask my lot to stall until at least next week anyway ... i.e. whenever the earliest date I can get a test appointment is...

vaio

You have much more leverage over the third party insurance company so I’d certainly be dealing direct with them rather than through your own insurance company

anniecave

If you pursue the other party for the value of the damage to your car then it would depend on the the cost of the repairs versus it's write-off value.

If it would clearly be cheaper to write the car off then you'd just have another write-off on the records but you'd get the benefit of the money.

If however it would actually be cheaper to repair it, then I'm not sure. You could negotiate on this I suppose. The presumption would be that it would be repaired.