'Don't pay your kids tuition fees upfront' Discussion Area

Oldernotwiser

PaulW1965 wrote: »

So I take it you're only on this thread for a nice slice of schadenfruede....... ?

I'm sticking with this thread to counterbalance the scaremongering tactics of some people who seem to have an axe to grind.

melancholly

arsenalbarnie wrote: »

So if it is going to be the taxpayers that ultimately pay for this mess, why bother doing all this to start with? Why not have free university education, no, the govt want us to think everyone is paying for their own degrees, when really the taxpayer is going to be picking up the bill in the long run. I don't get it. It may eventually start paying for itself in 35 years time, that's if we have any universities left.

well that's a fair point and the fact that there won't be a considerable cost saving to the tax payer of the new system has barely been reported. it's pretty scandalous that the bill got passed on that basis, when it quite clearly is not true. as with many things, the specifics of how a policy is implemented really matter to see if it's doing what they claim. the increased interest rates for higher earners and potential early repayment fees seem to be aimed at making sure that some more money is made.

but either way, however mad i think the changes are (plus if you factor in the cost of changing the whole system in terms of parliamentary time and cost to the unis of overhauling all of their systems to fit in, it's an even dafter idea), this is what we have. i wish this wasn't what we ended up with, for many reasons, but the current loans system is what prospective students have to get their heads around.

PaulW1965

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I'm sticking with this thread to counterbalance the scaremongering tactics of some people who seem to have an axe to grind.

You want less kids to go to uni, you are happy for the middle classes to pay through the nose and you seem to have an intense dislike for young, middle class kids and you're posting on a thread about middle class parents paying tuition fees upfront. Are you sure it isn't you who has an axe to grind?

PaulW1965

Lokolo wrote: »

It doesn't matter whether the money is paid now, or later, or whether it is written off, you need to look at it on simple terms for a debate on this thread.

It does if you are trying to work out when the burden falls on the tax payer which, if you remember, was the point that arsenalbarnie was making when you "questioned" his understanding.....

...hey I'm just saying....

kayr_2

PaulW1965 wrote: »

You want less kids to go to uni, you are happy for the middle classes to pay through the nose and you seem to have an intense dislike for young, middle class kids and you're posting on a thread about middle class parents paying tuition fees upfront. Are you sure it isn't you who has an axe to grind?

Not going to get into most of this but the point about fewer people going to university is an interesting one. Thinking that does not mean you are anti middle class etc. Many people feel that there are too many "degrees" which don't require high academic ability and are of dubious value to the student who would be better served by a different sort of post school training. To be fair to Tony Blair (goes against my instincts as I can't stand the man!) when he called for 50% to go into training/higher ed after school he did talk about training but society seemed to interpret that as university as that was the ideal. There seems to be a feeling in society at large that it is unfair to suggest someone might be better off not going to university but some degrees aren't going to help the student get a decent job which an apprenticeship or something else might. I don't see the point of funding a degree which will not really be of much benefit to the individual or to the country. So if there were fewer places it would take the pressure of the funding. I have heard kids saying they won't go to university "because of the fees" and in many cases you could think they actually would be served better by an alternative training anyway. It will be a shame if students for whom university would be a good choice are put off though.

I have no interest in arguing with anyone; I share the anger and despondency about the current proposals with PaulW1965 and others. However I think the purpose of this forum is to gain/share information and thoughts which might enable parents and students to make the wisest decisions in a very complex situation. Also, although I may disagree with ONW on a number of points, I don't think she necessarily has any axes! We all have a different take on things, usually because we have had different experiences in life.

Lokolo

PaulW1965 wrote: »

It does if you are trying to work out when the burden falls on the tax payer which, if you remember, was the point that arsenalbarnie was making when you "questioned" his understanding.....

...hey I'm just saying....

Which we both agree does fall in the taxpayer, but you are arguing as to when, which doesn't really matter does it?

Oldernotwiser

PaulW1965 wrote: »

You want less kids to go to uni, you are happy for the middle classes to pay through the nose and you seem to have an intense dislike for young, middle class kids and you're posting on a thread about middle class parents paying tuition fees upfront. Are you sure it isn't you who has an axe to grind?

Just to correct you.

I want fewer university places and I want them for the most able, not for those with well off parents. I also want them to be better funded than the current system.

I hadn't realised that this was a thread for the middle classes, I thought it was for parents with plenty of money to throw around who were trying to scare off parents and students from more normal backgrounds and return university education to those who can afford to pay for it.

If that's an axe, I'll keep on grinding it!

Taiko

In closing, ONW doesn't hate middle class people. She just hates everyone, equally.

Or maybe that's just myself.

kayr_2

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

I want fewer university places and I want them for the most able, not for those with well off parents. I also want them to be better funded than the current system.

Sounds OK to me.

Oldernotwiser

Taiko wrote: »

In closing, ONW doesn't hate middle class people. She just hates everyone, equally.

Or maybe that's just myself.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl: