Housing Benefit - buying a flat for our disabled daughter

Sanzomat

Hi All, hopefully some experts on HB rules for renting to family members out there! The advice we've found on-line generally makes sense but the indications from our local benefits office don't seem to agree so we are dreading getting their finding on our daughters HB claim.
The storey (shortened version) is that our daughter suffers from chronic pain due to a joint condition and, possibly as a result, also suffers from chronic fatigue. This impacts massively on her life as she has had to give up education and really has no prospects of employment. She would like a degree of independance and as she's nearly 20 would like to move away from home (although she will always need care/support). She also needs more suitable accommodation as our house doesn't have downstairs bathing facilities and she can barely manage the stairs so a ground floor flat would be ideal.
She tried moving out into a (downstairs) room in a shared house and got HB with no trouble. It worked out for a while but the house wasn't really suitable and sharing facilities (plus prepay meters that her housemates frequently let run out as they didn't pay there share) really got her down so she became quite depressed and had to give up the tenancy and move home again. We've been trying to find something more suitable but as she's too young to get HB for anything more than a shared place she cannot afford anything that would be more suitable for the HB she can get. The other issue is that she relies on her dog for companionship and a degree of practical support (although not formally trained as an assistance dog) and all private rented accommodation says no to her dog.
We've found a solution that seems to work - we've found a flat for sale that we can just about afford to buy. Its a one bedroom ground floor flat with a garden and a parking space so ideal in every respect for her disability and dog needs. We're buying it and we can afford to rent it to her for the "room in a shared house" HB rate and break even.
However, we come up against the "renting to a family member" rules of commerciality and contrivance. If we were to rent out the flat privately we could expect to achieve around £495 pm but as our daughter can only get the shared rate of £270 that's all she would be able to afford to pay us in rent. Thats fine by us as that will allow us to break even. Articles we have found say that as long as we put into place a formal tenancy agreement we will cover off the commercial aspect and these suggest that a low rent shouldn't be used to suggest it isn't commercial or make it "contrived" however we've spoken to the LA benefits officer who says that they will compare our rent to the market rate and if it is too low they will say it is not commercial/is contrived and will refuse the claim.
If we set the rent higher then they should allow the claim but then our daughter won't be able to afford it so we'll have to give her money to give back to us (which sounds pretty contrived to me!) and we'll have to pay tax on the full amount as income even though in reality we only get a part of it.
Other articles say that if the tenancy is set up to provide suitable accommodation for a disabled person then it cannot be seen as contrived but our LA don't seem to recognise that.
Does anyone know how these rules really should be applied as it seems to be totally up to the local authority to make their own judgements and ours don't seem to be very conducive to what seems to us to be the perfect solution to the problem in that they won't have to pay any more than the shared rate and she would get accommodation suited to her needs. Any help or advice would be gratefully received. Thanks for reading.

clemmatis

I really don't know, sorry, but would suggest you ask the EHRC, which replaced the Disability Rights Commission

'phone numbers here

http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/

Hammyman

If it is a contrived tenancy, i.e you bought it specifically to rent to her then you are going to stand a snowballs chance in hell of her getting HB. For her to get HB the rent would have to be set at the market value and the property has to be equally available for anyone else to rent.

My brother who knows the regs inside and out will be here later so I'll ask and update. He can quote the regulations that apply if it is possible.

real1314

A contrived tenancy is not defined as one set up to rent to as specific person, and the rules do not have any reference to renting a property to a family memeber. (they do have rules about rent where you live with the family member).

The actually issue with contrived tenancies is if they have been set up to "take advantage" of the HB scheme.

The simplest situation that this can be resolved from is where the person in question is already receivng HB. You cannot be taking advantage of it, as it's already paying out.

It might be "convenient" to rent to/from family, it might even be easier, and it might even give you both a financial boost, but the alternative may well be that the same HB could be paid to another LL, so in this scenario there is no issue with "taking advantage" of HB.

ps. That post about Human Rights; Ignore it. It's hardly likely to provide a solution to your problem. :cool:

clemmatis

ps. That post about Human Rights; Ignore it. It's hardly likely to provide a solution to your problem. :cool:

I gave the EHRC link, real, because the OP said

Other articles say that if the tenancy is set up to provide suitable accommodation for a disabled person then it cannot be seen as contrived but our LA don't seem to recognise that.

Part of the EHRC's remit is to offer information about the law, current British law, as it relates to disabled people. Its web page makes that clear. It can provide information and advice.

But I take it you are an expert in this field, and are telling the OP -- well, what are you telling the OP?

bobajob_1966

The EHRC advise on equality issues, not general disability law. This is not an equality/ discrimination issue.

OP, can you point us to these articles that state that providing accom for a disabled person will not be a contrived tenancy? I have never heard of this.

clemmatis

bobajob_1966 wrote: »

The EHRC advise on equality issues, not general disability law. This is not an equality/ discrimination issue.

this is I think a matter of definition, as disability law is, IMO, about equality. It is though true that there are others who could inform and advise on the points the OP raises, and in particular,

OP, can you point us to these articles that state that providing accom for a disabled person will not be a contrived tenancy? I have never heard of this.

I thought they might be able to comment on this or suggest someone who knew about the field. -- I thought it was worth a 'phone call by the OP.

bobajob_1966

clemmatis wrote: »

this is I think a matter of definition, as disability law is, IMO, about equality. It is though true that there are others who could inform and advise on the points the OP raises, and in particular,



I thought they might be able to comment on this or suggest someone who knew about the field. -- I thought it was worth a 'phone call by the OP.

I am guessing you have not ever dealt with them - they don't know half the stuff that is within their remit, let alone something way off like this.

bobajob_1966

Tory70 wrote: »

What benefits is your daughter in receipt of?

Are you thinking one bedroom rate might be a possibility?

pmlindyloo

I think there are 2 different issues here.

1. Is it a contrived tenancy?
2. Is your daughter entitled to the 1 bedroomed rate because she is disabled.

If your council is saying that they would be willing to accept that it is not a contrived tenancy if you charged a commercial rent then you need to find out what the rent is for the kind of flat you are buying. From what you have said and from my understanding it is only contrived if you are trying to defraud the benefit system. In my opinion you are not because if your daughter went and found somewhere to live herself she would be entitled to HB. In fact she has done this.

Therefore, and apologies if this is longwinded, the crucial point is should your daughter be entitled to the 1 bedroomed rate as she is disabled?

I cannot find the relevant 'law' but I have read this somewhere on a council website so will try and find it.

bobajob_1966

pmlindyloo wrote: »

I think there are 2 different issues here.

1. Is it a contrived tenancy?
2. Is your daughter entitled to the 1 bedroomed rate because she is disabled.

If your council is saying that they would be willing to accept that it is not a contrived tenancy if you charged a commercial rent then you need to find out what the rent is for the kind of flat you are buying. From what you have said and from my understanding it is only contrived if you are trying to defraud the benefit system. In my opinion you are not because if your daughter went and found somewhere to live herself she would be entitled to HB. In fact she has done this.

Therefore, and apologies if this is longwinded, the crucial point is should your daughter be entitled to the 1 bedroomed rate as she is disabled?

I cannot find the relevant 'law' but I have read this somewhere on a council website so will try and find it.

That is incorrect - the fact that she would be entitled to LHA/ HB elsewhere is irrelevant.

Those in receipt of DLA MRC or higher are entitled to the one bedroom rate, irrespective of age.