Mum widowed, dad left no will. Mum wants home to go to son

John_Pierpoint

EricTheKing7 wrote: »

The estate was valued approx £280K - £100,000 savings and the property approx £170,000. I know my mother could afford to pay towards any future care as my father was a hard worker and would rather save than spend foolishly. But it would break my mother's heart if she had to sell the family home to pay for further care costs. If this can be avoided / protected legally, then we would be silly not to.

Even under the present intestacy, the local authority will not be able to grab the house.
The spouse, since 2009 gets the first 250,000 of the estate. I presume your widowed mother will need as much cash as possible so there is a bit of house left over after she gets the savings and a chunk of the house. This 30,000 of house has 15,000 held in trust as you mother's "interest in possession" (life interest) trust and the children (you and your brother?) get 7,500 each.
But you need not make this too obvious, just make it clear on the Land Registration that the house is owned by trustees - If you are the sole name on the letters of administration it could be said that you are the legal owner of the house.(All be it you would be holding the proceeds of sale in trust).
The chances of mum needing to go into a care home are about 1 in 4.
[This statistic has been debated at length on this forum, some think that more than 3 out of 4 elderly women avoid the care home for their final years.]

Even if your mother needs to go into a care home, it might not be for long and a house in trust tends to go onto the "too difficult" pile.

The debate goes on:

http://www.thomaseggar.com/webfiles/pdfs/PCDR,%20Intestacy,%20Reforms%20for%20the%20surviving%20Spouse,%20Jan10.pdf

Personally, I don't think it is in the nation's interest to have a significant number of family homes, with one elderly widow rattling about inside them BUT owner ship of the (now empty) nest tends to define the identity of such
matriarchs.

John_Pierpoint

pmlindyloo wrote: »

I believe this information will be on your title deeds.

You can download a copy of these for £4 from www.landregistry.gov.uk

The link below takes you to the "both must agree" clause on land held as "tenants in common":
http://www.netlawman.co.uk/info/co-ownership-property.php

I believe that if you turn up in person at one of the (not yet closed) Land Registry offices, you are allowed to inspect your own title for free; but now we have the interweb etc. that might no longer be true.

With the exception of Tunbridge Wells, I have found the staff very understanding and prepared to "go the extra mile" as long as you accept that they are qualified by experience, so cannot give you legal advice.

margaretclare

The chances of mum needing to go into a care home are about 1 in 4.
[This statistic has been debated at length on this forum, some think that more than 3 out of 4 elderly women avoid the care home for their final years.]

I've seen similar figures, but it's amazing how often this type of question recurs on these boards. There's a lot of folklore out there to the effect that 'they put you in a home and steal your house' or 'the Government takes all you have' - the Government, in some quarters, are seen as barefaced thieves ready with claws outstretched to pounce like cat on mouse! No matter this is nonsense - a lot of people are firmly convinced of it.

I am this sort of age-group and I do NOT give a moment's thought to having to go into a care home - I'm too busy living my life for the time I have left - whereas I've seen posts on this site and others, people much younger than me who seem obsessed with the idea of 'saving the house when I go into care'. When, not if.

clemmatis

margaretclare wrote: »

I've seen similar figures, but it's amazing how often this type of question recurs on these boards. There's a lot of folklore out there to the effect that 'they put you in a home and steal your house' or 'the Government takes all you have' - the Government, in some quarters, are seen as barefaced thieves ready with claws outstretched to pounce like cat on mouse! No matter this is nonsense - a lot of people are firmly convinced of it.

I am this sort of age-group and I do NOT give a moment's thought to having to go into a care home - I'm too busy living my life for the time I have left - whereas I've seen posts on this site and others, people much younger than me who seem obsessed with the idea of 'saving the house when I go into care'. When, not if.

I agree, margaretclare. And also, people ignore many aspects of the current laws and rules -- for example, the total protection for live-in dependent relatives and relatives over 60, and pretty strong protection for live-in non-dependent relatives under 60 (I was one). Also many who post here about their parents ignore the fact that savings can be used to choose a nursing home, or hire carers from a private agency of their choice.

Mojisola

clemmatis wrote: »

Also many who post here about their parents ignore the fact that savings can be used to choose a nursing home

Also, if you're self-funding, you still get your pension or pensions if you have a personal pension in addition to the state one, maybe Pension Credit or Savings Credit and probably Attendance Allowance so you only need to use your savings to make up the difference between that total and the care home fees.

clemmatis

Oh yes, indeed. My mother had a state pension and attendance allowance (and a very very very small occupational pension!) ; and after she'd been there three months, the Welsh Assembly introduced a £100 a week payment for all nursing home residents certified as needing nursing care.

EricTheKing7

Thanks everyone. Maybe I have been too easily scared about the consequences of care costs that may never be needed. I will get a solicitors appointment booked for my mum. I think she might as well have the house in her sole name, and she can consider how she wishes to leave it in her will. But we will see what the solicitor has to say first. Thanks everyone for your time and advise. I will try and update this thread once we've seen the solicitor.

Mrs_Money

No-one is intimating that the need for care is inescapable, but a property can be changed to Tenants in Common and then everyone can forget about it all. If care is needed at some point in the future and there is no cash to self-fund, then half the property can be willed to beneficiaries or retained by the co-owner. If care is never needed then it won't matter at all and the property is left to whoever in a will.
Unfortunately the LA can and do take your house (or put a charge on it when it is ultimately sold), unless you have enough money to self fund - around £700-£800 per week. There's not many lucky folk that have that sort of cash and it doesn't matter who the house is willed to, they won't inherit it (or at least not all of it) if there is any money owed to the LA.
Friends of mine have just updated their wills, done Enduring Power of Attorney and put their house deeds as Tenants in Common and they are only 60, fit, healthy and active - I wish I was this organised. But they realised from personal experience, that it is no good waiting until any situation actually occurs- it will then be too late.

Mojisola

Mrs_Money wrote: »

No-one is intimating that the need for care is inescapable, but a property can be changed to Tenants in Common

This is okay if the people involved are spouses/partners. If half the house is handed over to another relative without a good reason I think it would still be considered deliberate deprivation.

margaretclare

Friends of mine have just updated their wills, done Enduring Power of Attorney and put their house deeds as Tenants in Common and they are only 60, fit, healthy and active - I wish I was this organised. But they realised from personal experience, that it is no good waiting until any situation actually occurs- it will then be too late.

The title to this property is in joint names because that's the way we wanted it. Or rather, I wanted it, not so much DH. We've recently re-done our wills and had the opportunity to update everything. We also did Enduring Power of Attorney a couple of years ago now.

I didn't want to get into this whole game of leaving half a property to someone else. Whoever survives of this couple - us - must have the complete right to inherit everything and it will then be up to him/her to make decisions about what is left, or to use it if required.