Have the Greeks Actually DONE Anything to Address Their Deficit?

System

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

If spending falls 10% and GDP falls 10% as a result, then the deficit remains the same. .

That's false reasoning. GDP is the total national income. It's not the government income.

Falling GDP may lower government income, or it may not. If the government has a fixed income derived from the small percentage of honest taxpayers, then it can reduce the deficit by cutting expenditure.

Graham_Devon

Seems were in for another couple of weeks of "oh my god, Greece might default" and leaders running around suggesting they won't give them extra money, but then they will go ahead and throw more moeny at the unavoidable problem anyway.

It all started up again this morning on the radio. Greece is going to run out of money by october if it doesn't get new loans. Economists all pretty much agree, Greece cannot continue as it is doing, but they all also agree that the EU leaders won't accept this and will make sure this goes on for some time yet.

This:

Mrs Merkel and Mr Sarkozy said in a joint statement: "Putting into place commitments of the (bailout) programme is essential for the Greek economy to return to a path of lasting and balanced growth."

was laughed at nervously and looked upon with pity.

As a blogger says....for real people on the ground in the EU, frankly they just despair.

ILW

And meanwhile they just go on spending other peoples money. Crazy.

daveyjp

The Greeks in Athens are trying - according to a Greek commentator on Newsnight batering is back - those who can't cope are heading for the hills and going back to subsistence farming.

ILW

daveyjp wrote: »

The Greeks in Athens are trying - according to a Greek commentator on Newsnight batering is back - those who can't cope are heading for the hills and going back to subsistence farming.

Anything to avoid paying tax.

pqrdef

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Seems were in for another couple of weeks of "oh my god, Greece might default" and leaders running around suggesting they won't give them extra money, but then they will go ahead and throw more moeny at the unavoidable problem anyway.

Well, if the bailout plan releases the planned money in quarterly chunks, it's always going to be the case that the country will run out of money if it doesn't get the next chunk. So what?

But making each chunk conditional on a review is hardly the way to inspire confidence in the markets. Who knows when politicians will be crazy enough to choose the non-option?

ILW

pqrdef wrote: »

Well, if the bailout plan releases the planned money in quarterly chunks, it's always going to be the case that the country will run out of money if it doesn't get the next chunk. So what?

But making each chunk conditional on a review is hardly the way to inspire confidence in the markets. Who knows when politicians will be crazy enough to choose the non-option?

You seem to be suggesting that keeping on throwing cash at them forever is the answer.

Mrs_Bones

I know in the summer this next big chunk of money was voted on and passed through, but I thought it had run in to problems and things were not quite as certain now? The Fin's for one I think are having big doubts about it, nothing is certain.

ILW

i have some German friends and do fear things could get sticky.

The attitude amongst many is that they are paying for the Greeks to have higher levels of pensions, benefits etc etc than most germans and using German taxpayers money to fund it, whilst most Greeks avoid paying their taxes. The right wing parties are seeing a great deal of interest from people who are normally pretty moderate voters. The next election could be quite frightening in it's possible long term consequenses.

pqrdef

ILW wrote: »

The attitude amongst many is that they are paying for the Greeks to have higher levels of pensions, benefits etc etc than most germans

They wouldn't rather have jobs then.

If they'd sooner have an economy like Greece's instead of their own, I'm sure it could be arranged.