Anyone ever had their community service passed back to court?

abi-em-mum83

dirtysexymonkey wrote: »

so your just like her! thought so. please do stick together and steal from each other and not the rest of us.

Dirtysexymoney, thought you said you could read? Maybe you could re-read my first post and see my experience is from WORKING within community service, not as someone who has undertaken any! I shadowed a CSO for 8 weeks, as well as volunteering in a CS placement for 3 months!
But suppose you dont have much time to read things properly while your JUMPING to those conclusions! pmsl!!

Kay_Peel

abi-em-mum83 wrote: »

BTW IF it went back to court I doubt very much a prison sentence would be handing out. There are limits and guideline as to what you can be given. Community Service is actually quite a low tarriff punishment,not a direct alternative to prison. Its very very unlikely that if you have complied to the best of your ability a judge would go straight from community service to imprisonment. Its like swatting a fly with a cannon ball!lol

Wrong! :eek:

It's a direct alternative to prison.
http://www.london-probation.org.uk/what_we_do/community_order.aspx It's very high tarriff

And yes - if it means having to take her children with her then at least she will have demonstrated to her CSO that she is going to do her hours but needs help.

Of course she'll be sent home.

She'll also be sent home if she's incapacitated by medication - so keep off 'em before a placement.

I think you must be confusing Community Service orders with something else. Best not to offer advice if you've only half an idea rather than an indepth knowledge of how the system works.

DVardysShadow

abi-em-mum83 wrote: »

Honestly, do you think this person would be allowed to take her children? Quite often these placements are in charity shops, litter picking, painting fences on pavements etc. DO you seriously suggest she takes her YOUNG children with her? Thats ridiculous! I know when I did work experience within my local community service children were not allowed on the premises, we had offenders who were turned away from meeting because they had no childcare available and thought they were doing their best by still turning up,child in tow! She would not be allowed to take her children with her!

But the point is not to complete the assignment against any disapproval of whoever. The point is to turn up and be counted as turning up rather than be wrongly classified as one of those community service people who stay in bed rather than turn up.

What MUST be achieved is that when this gets taken back to court, OP is dealt with as having difficult childcare issues, so that it is left at an equivalent of the original sentence rather than having extra heaped on for failing to comply with the court order.

DVardysShadow

dirtysexymonkey wrote: »

you really cant see where shes practically begging for sympathy? none of this is relevant! its all so people say poor you, its not your fault you STOLE FROM THE REST OF US.

If you don't get your constructive head on, this is going to turn out very badly for OP. Never mind 'stealing from the rest of us'. OP's situation with children and a lot of stress may turn out to have dire social consequences for her, which may delight you no end, but will probably cost 'THE REST OF US' many hundreds of times the cost of the original offence.

I think that the consequences of self righteous grandstanding on crime are doing us all more harm than crime itself at the moment.

Kimberley82

Jail is really not fun.

How about contacting the local college and seeing if any of the students doing childcare want to earn some money every other weekend by caring for the children.

abi-em-mum83

Kay_Peel wrote: »

Wrong! :eek:

It's a direct alternative to prison.
http://www.london-probation.org.uk/what_we_do/community_order.aspx It's very high tarriff

And yes - if it means having to take her children with her then at least she will have demonstrated to her CSO that she is going to do her hours but needs help.

Of course she'll be sent home.

She'll also be sent home if she's incapacitated by medication - so keep off 'em before a placement.

I think you must be confusing Community Service orders with something else. Best not to offer advice if you've only half an idea rather than an indepth knowledge of how the system works.

So why can somebody be allowed to be under the influence of methedone because its prescribed, yet not prescribed painkillers? Is she really supposed to go 10 hours without pain relief, the type she depends on to stop unbearable pain? Surely thats inhumane, you wouldnt allow a dog to go 10 hours in excruciating pain?
You are right to an extent, but going to prison is not the next step. There is many other punishments she could be given, suspended sentence, tagging order, fine. A judge is not going to say ok you cant do community service for such and such reasons,despite trying,, lets cart you off to over stretched prisons, at a large expense to the tax payer, meaning your partner cant work, cant pay his tax, claim benefits to care for your children, and be unable to repay your large debts to the government?
I DO agree however that if there is NO OTHER OPTION she should take her children with her to appointments. Of course she'll get turned away but she would show willing in turning up, and prove that she has no other options. Also just thought, at my placement there was a creche scheme, would it be worth seeing if there is one in your area scabbymonkey, or seeing if there is any subsidised childcare? They cant tell you not to take pain relief if its a prescribed medication, but could they maybe change your placement? We had a craft placement, where the offender made arts and crafts that were sold at a later date. Obviously this would be something that you could do that wouldnt pose a risk to you or others? Just some thoughts on keeping this from the court!

Kay_Peel

abi-em-mum83 wrote: »

...but going to prison is not the next step. There is many other punishments she could be given, suspended sentence, tagging order, fine. A judge is not going to say ok you cant do community service for such and such reasons,despite trying,, lets cart you off to over stretched prisons, at a large expense to the tax payer, meaning your partner cant work, cant pay his tax, claim benefits to care for your children, and be unable to repay your large debts to the government?

Try to understand this. At the trial, the judge will have considered the appropriate sentence including those that you've outlined above. This judge decided that prison was the right sentence, but that it should be served in the community. That's what a Community Order is. When you breach that order then the judge isn't going to lower the tarriff, he or she raises it, to prison.

The OP knows this. That's why she's asking for advice. Your interjections (which I can sympathise with because they are well-meant) aren't answering the OP's questions.

By the way, judges send 'breachers' to prison in the blink of an eye.

FBaby

I think you desperately need to focus on what you CAN do rather than not. There are ways to find childcare, as suggested, you could see if a college student could help or maybe your family could agree to come and stay for the week-end whilst you are doing your service. If it means your partner driving hours to pick them up on Friday evening and dropping them off again on Sunday evening, so be it.

As for the painkillers, you're going to have to give it a try. Let THEM decide that you can't carry on your duties because you are in so much pain, rather than you telling them you can't come because you will be in too much pain without them.

At the moment, you are expected to do community as an alternative to going to jail, surely the onus is on you to do everything possible to do so. The circumstances might stack against you, but from your OP, you are not showing much dedication to try to find a solution, more coming up with reasons why you can't.

thorsoak

scabbymonkey
28-07-2011, 2:13 PM MoneySaving Newbie


Join Date: Jul 2011

As the title says I really hope people can put their assumptions and judgements aside and give me some helpful advice. (p.s if it helps Im in scotland)
Basically I was made bankrupt in 2007 for council tax arrears, and it was a relief as my ex had ran up huge debts in my name, and I was struggling. I was discharged May 2010.
Since then I have fallen in diffuclty again. There are debts to Provident, mobile phones and Bt, totalling approx £1500 (provident alone is £1100). But I owe for over payments to several agencies including £3600 to HMRC, £4800 DWP £3700 housing benefit and £2400 for council tax. Basically I was a single parent claiming benefits, but was prosecuted for fraud as they said my ex was a partner. He stayed one night a week, on a fold out bed in childrens room, while I stayed with my boyfriend in his house. It was the only way he could spend time with his children, as he lives 3 hours away and cant have them to stay in the b&b he lived at. I notified the local authority (my landlord) as soon as we had agreed. We were advised by CSA to come to a mutual agreement for maintenence rather than go through them, which we did, and since ex only had basic account, no debit/credit card he paid me cash, which I noted in a notebook and we both signed. He would come through and take me to hospital appointments and watch children while I was there, and on several occasions stayed in my home with them while I was admitted to hospital for a few days. He also brought shopping into my home for us on a few occasions as I couldnt get out to shops due to my health problems and being bed bound. Despite us both having new partners, I was still found as having a partner and prosecuted. I was given 100 hours community service which I have done, but paying back the overpayments are crippling me and Im falling behind every month. I have supplied SOA's but they still wont reduce payments.
Basically Im wondering if I was to go bankrupt again then would these overpayments be included? How do I go about declaring myself bankrupt? Please dont say go to citizens advice as our towns one is only on for 2 days a week and the waiting time is 4-5 hours. I cant do that with 3 toddlers! And when I called for an appointment I was told it was a 10-12 week wait!! Any advice?
***********

So is this a completely different scenario? Or are we talking about one and the same thing?



Anyone ever had their community service passed back to court?
"Hi I was given 180 hours community service, and have 150 hours left. Before going to court a report was compiled, and in it I explained how I have young children,no support, serious health issues and a partner who works 60-70 hours, 6 days a week. I had a battle with the community service officer at the beginning over what tasks I was able to do due to health, as well as trying to bend over backwards to work when they wanted. Neither of my children are at school, I have no family here and cannot afford childcare. other half works 6 days, and due to being management involved in transport can often be made to work late at very short notice. A recent stint in hospital left me on very strong painkillers which make me zombie like. I am in constant daily agony, regular emergency hospital admissions and doctors have no idea whats causing the pain. I am due to have exploratory surgery, and could end up with a hysterectomy aged 26. Even then they dont know if it will stop the pain.
Despite being very open and upfront to community service, and trying everything I can to get to placement, its becoming very very difficult, and they keep changing the agreements. We arranged it would be every other saturday 9-5 to fit in with my other halfs work. He agreed with his area manager that if anything came up on the days I have to be at placement,they'd have to make other arrangements. This has caused trouble with his employers. Then the CSO decided I could no longer do every other saturday and would have to be 5-9 mon-fri, or 9-5 saturday and sunday. I explained my partner works till 6, and isnt home till almost 7, even on the nights he isnt working late, and he HAS to work alternate saturdays and sundays. While partner is at work I am the only person to care for our young children. Childcare for them both for a full day would be £80 per day (cheapest quote) and since I cant work with my health, it would have to come out of my partners wages, and this would be impossible to find! Neither of us have family within 100 miles, and all my friends work and have their own children (I have asked them to watch the children 1 day at the weekend and all have said no)
I attended placement last week under the influence of my very strong painlkillers (I have provided a letter off my GP to community service stating what medication I am on, why I need it, when I need it and how it could effect me). I was sent home because I am now not allowed to be under the influence of anything other than paracetamol! Without these painkillers I am in agony, barely able to move. My cso has basically saying unless the restricitons I have change he wants to refer my case back to court, and the way he makes it sound is that the judge would be likely to imprison me!
Now I WANT to do my punishment, I really am doing my best. Even after being mugged when leaving a placement by someone Id worked alongside all day, I put my head down and got on with it! I am not trying to get out of my punishment at all, but I have genuine restrictions on when and what I can do. If I could go back to working every other weekend, and allowed to take my painkillers I would happily get on with it. But they keep moving the goalposts and Im stuck!
has anyone had a similar situation? Im scared witless at the thought of going back to court (this is a first offence and last offence, Im a university graduate,previously held a professional position, never been in trouble with police). Going to court the first time made me suicidal, I dont know if I could deal with going through it again! But I cannot go without pain medication without being in agony, we could not find the £320 a month childcare (we are with CCCS as it is and on a very tight budget, so tight I'm down to one meal a day to save money), and the only way partner could change his hours would be to change his employment, and theres nothing suitable going at the minute (plus he loves his job and is on course for a big promotion and pay rise soon). Citizens Advice suggested I should ASK for it to be referred back to court as community service is not the best option for either side, and I have the proof Ive done everything
possible to fulfill my punishment, but its being made near impossible for me!
Sorry for rambling, any advice, (without the b-itching) would be appreciated!!"

thegirlintheattic

Jail, fine or community service. Your not going to go back to court and the judge go "oh, well, you tried. We'll wipe those extra hours off".

Surely a fine or jail would be worse.