Employment Issues

HeadAbove_2

Good morning all,

Apologies for this being a bit long winded, just think you all need a clear picture of my situation......

Below is a list of events in chronological order that should hopefully let you see what has gone on and perhaps somebody can offer me some advice? I worked for an investment company and carried out a controlled function, if this makes a difference.

July 2008: Had a disciplinary investigation upheld against me resulting in a final written warning (no prior indiscretions). This was due to my stupidity and I held my hands up at the time; bottom line is I gave some incorrect information to an intermediary, and whilst it was done in an effort to assist, it was wrong. Warning was to remain on file for 12 months but no further action taken.

September 2008: Was promoted within the firm to the role of Trainee Investment Adviser, meaning I had more responsibility and the controlled function was more relevant.

June 2010: After carrying out my role expertly and without issue, the firm decided to remove my controlled function, saying that they should have done this in '08 following the disciplinary but it was overlooked (I don't actually think it should have been, but that's beside the point). I contested this at the time but the decision stood; I still had the same job role but with diminished responsibility.

March 2011: I had been dealing with a case for a client and somewhere along the line a couple of emails didn't get answered. A complaint came in and at the time of the complaint I had no recognition of the emails. They were pulled from the archive files and I agreed to having seen them before but I had no idea as to why they were not still visible. If they had been, they would have been answered, it wasn't a hard case. I was sacked for gross misconduct on 3 charges; not answering the emails, knowingly deleting them to cover my tracks and lying to management about doing so. The first point I could not argue but the other two were contested as they were untrue. As well as sacking me for gross misconduct they offered my £5,000 as long as I signed a compromise agreement. :eek:

March 2011: I appealed against the decision to sack me and won, being reinstated in early April but with a fresh final written warning against me for not answering the emails (harsh, but fair enough I guess). As the company was, at the time, carrying out redundancies I was not required to return to work until decisions had been made.

May 2011: Surprise, surprise. I was made redundant.

After this time I went away and re-trained as a mortgage adviser as there wasn't a great deal of opportunity for investment managers in my area.

It had been hard going trying to find companies that are taking on mortgage advisers but I had found one willing to do so.

However........

A reference was provided from my previous employer. The base information is factually correct but the reference in itself is written in such a way as to make everything seem 100 x worse than it is. It also includes such choice phrases as 'No liability will be accepted for any loss that may be caused by xxxxxxx', which I feel makes it out that I'm some kind of thief (perhaps this is a standard statement, I don't know).

Bottom line is, from this reference I now have not got the job and if that is the reference I can expect going forward I think I can wave goodbye to my career in Financial Services.

Does anybody have any thoughts as to whether there's anything I can do, or where best to go for some (preferably free/cheap in the first instance) legal advice?

Apologies again for the long-winded nature of this

Jarndyce

Whilst references have to be factually correct, frankly with your disciplinary record (and the circumstances and background are immaterial) even a factual reference is not going to do you much good.

Is there a named individual that you know that might provide a more positive reference perhaps?

HeadAbove_2

Not within the firm unfortunately, they take an 'all-in' stance so that individuals cannot give references.

I've actually had references from some of the larger clients of the firm which are glowing but obviously they don't carry as much weight.

Do you not think there's anything in any part of the history of conduct that I can do?

SarEl

Financial services have special regulations about references - they must disclose disciplinary records. And other financial services must take up references from the former financial services employer - not someone else in the company. It seems to me that the very short quote you included is factually correct - the previous employer has disclosed the disciplinary record, clearly has no confidence in you, and is making it clear that anyone who employes you in this capacity "takes it on their own head". Which is perfectly justifiable in law. Just as a matter of interest - what did you tell the potential new employer about your disciplinary record? Because knowing that this would certainly come up in a reference (and will again for any financial services position), if you didn't tell them then I suspect that the reference will have come as something of an unwelcome surprise to the new employer. If it is your intention to try to stay in any form of financial services then you are going to have to find a way of managing this matter, because it is going to come up reference after reference, and no potential employer is happy to the the last to know.

Emmzi

No. You needed to appeal and overturn the warnings at the time. You didn't. Hindsight is a great thing, a compromise agreement + an agreed reference would have been the very thing right now

Altho yes, SarEl point re: financial services noted.

SarEl

Emmzi wrote: »

No. You needed to appeal and overturn the warnings at the time. You didn't. Hindsight is a great thing, a compromise agreement + an agreed reference would have been the very thing right now

I doubt if they would have agreed a reference - and if they had they could not have been bound by the agreement on a reference for another financial service.

SarEl

You edited that fast Emmzi - even the system didn't notice you do it!

Jarndyce

Didn't know that about financial services having special regulations for references. Learned something today thank you . Do you know what they are called or do you have a link?

SarEl

Jarndyce wrote: »

Didn't know that about financial services having special regulations for references. Learned something today thank you . Do you know what they are called or do you have a link?

Not off the top of my head - it's one of those things I know but seldom deal with. Some of our other posters around here have financial services backgrounds and can probably point you in the right direction. It's something to do with the FSA rules around probity and checking the credentials of the people employed in certain sectors / types of work. I have only come across it in relation to ensuring that records are expunged where an unfair dismissal has taken place, because even if a tribunal says it was unfair that does not change the record of dismissal at the financial service, and unless the record is expunged then it can still be cited on a reference!

HeadAbove_2

SarEl wrote: »

Financial services have special regulations about references - they must disclose disciplinary records. And other financial services must take up references from the former financial services employer - not someone else in the company. It seems to me that the very short quote you included is factually correct - the previous employer has disclosed the disciplinary record, clearly has no confidence in you, and is making it clear that anyone who employes you in this capacity "takes it on their own head". Which is perfectly justifiable in law. Just as a matter of interest - what did you tell the potential new employer about your disciplinary record? Because knowing that this would certainly come up in a reference (and will again for any financial services position), if you didn't tell them then I suspect that the reference will have come as something of an unwelcome surprise to the new employer. If it is your intention to try to stay in any form of financial services then you are going to have to find a way of managing this matter, because it is going to come up reference after reference, and no potential employer is happy to the the last to know.

Thanks for your response. I did tell the company up front about the disciplinary history and they were happy enough to go ahead and get references, its just that now the manner in which the reference came back from the previous employer it has spooked the compliance department of the new firm and it's all halted.

Strange really considering the base information is the same

HeadAbove_2

Emmzi wrote: »

No. You needed to appeal and overturn the warnings at the time. You didn't. Hindsight is a great thing, a compromise agreement + an agreed reference would have been the very thing right now

Altho yes, SarEl point re: financial services noted.

Like I said, at least the first warning was justified, I just didn't believe that the follow up action by the company was acceptable but couldn't persuade them otherwise.

I don't think accepting my gross misconduct charge, which was basically untrue and unfounded manure, just to get a reference (which would have been worse?!) would have been a particularly sensible option.

Do you not think it's odd that they sacked me for gross misconduct (albeit overturned) and offered me money??