What time is it Mr Wolf

Twister84

charlieboycat wrote: »

I don't see how "making payments up to /14:30/close of business/whatever time one's bank specifies" can affect the bank's decision on whether or not to allow the DD/SO/cheque despite insufficient funds - since that decision is taken early in the day.

Surely this "pay-in by whenever" mechanism only affects whether or not you got charged for being overdrawn - ie. it only comes into play in circumstances where the bank had decided earlier in the day to allow an overdraft.

With Natwest/RBS 14:30 pm is when the second daily autosweep occurs, so although the decision is made at 2.30 am (the time of the first autosweep), the "final" decision is made at 14.30 pm.

If you try to pay in after this time, the item may or may not be paid. Staff can try "manually" changing the decision after this time, but it is not to be relied upon.

noh

chazagill wrote: »

Maybe I should put it down to experience and change to a bank that does allow payments up until the end of business like RBS and Lloyds?

Or arrange an overdraft facility on your Flex Account so that you will avoid returned item/unarranged overdraft fees should such a situation arise in the future.

chazagill

charlieboycat wrote: »

I don't see how "making payments up to /14:30/close of business/whatever time one's bank specifies" can affect the bank's decision on whether or not to allow the DD/SO/cheque despite insufficient funds - since that decision is taken early in the day.

Surely this "pay-in by whenever" mechanism only affects whether or not you got charged for being overdrawn - ie. it only comes into play in circumstances where the bank had decided earlier in the day to allow an overdraft.

my point is I signed an agreement for the DD to be payed on the 1st of the month, as far as i am concerned monies was in my account on the 1st, why call 3.30pm the close of business if money is collected first thing?

chazagill

noh wrote: »

The goalposts have not been moved. As far as I remember the T+Cs have always been so. I have had a Flex Account for 23 years.

Thank you your input has been very helpful

dtsazza

chazagill wrote: »

my point is I signed an agreement for the DD to be payed on the 1st of the month, as far as i am concerned monies was in my account on the 1st, why call 3.30pm the close of business if money is collected first thing?

Because the terms don't say that the direct debit will be taken at close of business on the 1st. And in fact the account terms state that you need cleared funds available at COB the previous day, which more or less implies that the DD will be taken out at start of business on the 1st.

Consequently your account didn't have the money in when the DD was to be paid, and it was rejected.

Chalk this one up to experience.

chazagill

dtsazza wrote: »

Because the terms don't say that the direct debit will be taken at close of business on the 1st. And in fact the account terms state that you need cleared funds available at COB the previous day, which more or less implies that the DD will be taken out at start of business on the 1st.

Consequently your account didn't have the money in when the DD was to be paid, and it was rejected.

Chalk this one up to experience.

I do agree with you, and please don't think i'm being argumentative but T+C don't say they will be taken at the start of business either?

anna42hmr

ihateyes wrote: »

depends on the bank....

did lloyds not run an advertising campaign recently saying as long as funds were in by cop it would be honoured??

no, it was if you go overdrawn on the account, as long as cleared funds are received on that day before 3 or 3.30pm, then they will not charge for the overdraft. Lloyds like most banks have to have funds in the account by the night before to guarentee they honour direct debits/standing orders etc

topcat9

Hi Chazagill,

sorry if I'm just telling you what you already know, but even in today's world of faster payments and immediate (sometimes!) money transfers, direct debits and standing orders are still processed in the same way they have been for years - by an overnight batch computer run which has to be completed before business day begins. So your direct debit for the 1st of the month would have to have been processed at some time after midnight on the 1st for it to reach your creditor on the 1st.

However, as others have stated, during the working day of the 1st there is a "second chance" for any unpaid direct debits to be honoured. I'm with the Co-op, and the one time this happened to me I phoned first thing in the morning and they agreed to give me a temporary overdraft to let the direct debit go through until I could get into the bank later in the day to pay in the required amount.

So I don't think you can really complain about the timing of your direct debit, but I'm sure it would be worth trying for a goodwill refund of your fees if this has been a one-off genuine error!

noh

chazagill wrote: »

I do agree with you, and please don't think i'm being argumentative but T+C don't say they will be taken at the start of business either?

They don't you are correct.
What they do say is that you need cleared funds in your account at close of business the previous day.
The time the DD is taken from your account has no relevance. What matters is having cleared funds available at the end of the previous working day.

Wallhart

Just ask for the Direct Debits to be taken the next day.

I.e If 25th ask for it to be taken out the 26th.

Regards

Matt

P.S You ask the TV liscense credit control not your bank.