He wants refund, advice please

lynnemcf

I was booked to do a craft day at a local school. I was ill so I cancelled. School wanted someone so I asked two friends (Jane is experienced, Moira is a novice) to do the day. The school paid me in advance. I paid my friends in advance. My friends arrived at the school, Jane broke a tooth and left for the dentist. Moira stayed. Moira was honest and confessed to the head teacher that she was a novice and would do her best. The school used the materials they had provided. Moira said she had a great time at the school, and had positive feedback from the teachers. It is therefore a great shock to me that the school is asking for a full refund. Any advice very gratefully received.

Bossyboots

I don't see how they can expect a full refund if they used materials provided by your friends.

However, if they booked and agreed a price on the basis of the experience of the provider then I think they are justified in asking for a reduction. Ask them why they think they are due a refund. It may be that a review of the event afterwards threw up some areas where they could have expected better if they had got what they ordered. You need to negotiate a reduced fee with them that reflects the level of experience they got.

If you have paid your friend Jane and she did not in fact do the craft day, then she is due to refund you anyway. She surely cannot expect to be paid for an event she did not undertake. It is not your fault, nor the school's that she broke her tooth and she should pay you back.

robnye

Bossyboots wrote:

I don't see how they can expect a full refund if they used materials provided by your friends.

However, if they booked and agreed a price on the basis of the experience of the provider then I think they are justified in asking for a reduction. Ask them why they think they are due a refund. It may be that a review of the event afterwards threw up some areas where they could have expected better if they had got what they ordered. You need to negotiate a reduced fee with them that reflects the level of experience they got.

If you have paid your friend Jane and she did not in fact do the craft day, then she is due to refund you anyway. She surely cannot expect to be paid for an event she did not undertake. It is not your fault, nor the school's that she broke her tooth and she should pay you back.

i agree, for the possibility of future work from the school, it would be wiser to negotiate a reduction in costs. and as also mentioned, your friend should also refund you part of her fee........

Justin_Credit

That sounds spot on to me too.

JC

lynnemcf

Many thanks for your advice. I forgot to say that the event took place before Christmas. I guess thats why I feel particularly "wrong" asking Jane to repay her part of the fee, especially since she provided the supplies. £200 paid by school, Jane and Moira split the fee less supplies, so that was £60 to Moira, £60 to Jane, £80 for supplies. It means a refund of £60 to the school. Do I need to supply figures to the school that we spent £80 on supplies?

Bossyboots

lynnemcf wrote:

Many thanks for your advice. I forgot to say that the event took place before Christmas. I guess thats why I feel particularly "wrong" asking Jane to repay her part of the fee, especially since she provided the supplies. £200 paid by school, Jane and Moira split the fee less supplies, so that was £60 to Moira, £60 to Jane, £80 for supplies. It means a refund of £60 to the school. Do I need to supply figures to the school that we spent £80 on supplies?

Supplying the details of the supplies used should make it easier to prove that the £80 is not refundable under any circumstances. It seems reasonable to refund them £60 in the circumstances. I am surprised Jane did not offer you the money back as she did not do the work. You are either going to have to take the loss yourself or ask her for the money back.

I cannot see how the school can expect a better offer than £60. They did have someone there for the craft day so refunding half the event fee seems reasonable. They cannot expect Moira not to be paid unless they are now saying she was terrible but that does not sound as if it is the case. They used the supplies taken in by Moira and Jane and they cannot possibly expect you to refund that money.

Savvy_Sue

Hang on a minute, are you saying that the school is NOW asking for a refund for an event which took place before Christmas? And that they didn't at the time get in touch and say they were disappointed that it wasn't you and that it ended up being a novice leading it?

I'm sorry, but I think that's unreasonable. If they'd asked quickly, I'd have more sympathy for them.

You may decide to give them something back to keep their business, and telling them exactly how much was spent on supplies which they used might be helpful, but I think you could equally well keep it vague and say something like 'in excess of £80', 'almost half the fee', 'a significant percentage' - whatever suits your style.

And I wouldn't offer them £60. I'd not go above £50, and might even offer less than that and be prepared to haggle, because you've now spent time etc worrying about this and trying to sort it out. Also make it clear you're doing it as a gesture of goodwill and not because you think they are entitled to it!

Or better yet, why not offer them a discount if they book another day before the end of the summer term? Say, £60? It's not as if you currently have that money sitting in your bank account, you would have to get it back off Jane, and she may be in no position to pay it back to you immediately, she may have spent it before she broke her tooth, poor lady!

Now, if you can get your materials at a discount next time, you're well on the way to making up the loss they are imposing on you!

And did Jane spend any time at all at the school? If she did, she's surely entitled to a little bit ...

vanoonoo

Savvy_Sue wrote:

Or better yet, why not offer them a discount if they book another day before the end of the summer term?

I think this is absolutely acceptable - and send moira again

Bossyboots

The only reason I did not pick out the time scale here was that schools are incredibly busy places before Christmas and it does not seem unreasonable for them to only now be sending out correspondence in relation to this.

I did say in an earlier post here to ask why they thought they were entitled to a refund. Their argument may actually be completely baseless in which case they should not be offered anything. There is a breach of contract here though and also the OP's reputation to consider.

vanoonoo

schools are also businesses and need to fulfill terms and conditions and contracts. with respect, there was only a change of contractual agreement so the OP, whilst having to take into consideration their reputation, did actually meet the terms of the broad conditions which was to supply a craft day.

your point about reverting to the school for clarification is however fundamental.

lynnemcf

Its 13 weeks since the event took place.

To quote exactly the school said "the whole day did not happen. Our staff had to lead the sessions, your crafter joined in with them."

However, the feedback I had the day after the event from Jane and Moira was "the children got nearly a full day of fun. Faced with disappointing the children, Moira gave a lot of what they asked for. The other option would have been to pack up and say sorry, we're going home. We (Jane and Moira) chose to give them a day with an unqualified but creative teacher and the extensive variety of materials we provided."