extension for appealing ATOS medical?

DanielClark

I just got off the phone with my friend, and he told me that he called JCP to ask them if they got his appeal form. he told me that they are going to call back after checking it to see if he has a valid case for an appeal, they said he should not go anywhere for the next 3 hours, because they will only ring 3 times. this is beginning to sound to me like the original !!!! up in him trying to get hold of the examiners report.

he's confused and concerned by this. I don't know the first thing about these sorts of issues, so I'm of no help to him right now

can someone explain what the process is here? what happens if they decide his case is not valid? is that it? as it stands right now, he's not getting any benefits, and as such, he can't get his medication.

Muttleythefrog

DanielClark wrote: »

I just got off the phone with my friend, and he told me that he called JCP to ask them if they got his appeal form. he told me that they are going to call back after checking it to see if he has a valid case for an appeal, they said he should not go anywhere for the next 3 hours, because they will only ring 3 times. this is beginning to sound to me like the original !!!! up in him trying to get hold of the examiners report.

he's confused and concerned by this. I don't know the first thing about these sorts of issues, so I'm of no help to him right now

can someone explain what the process is here? what happens if they decide his case is not valid? is that it? as it stands right now, he's not getting any benefits, and as such, he can't get his medication.

To be honest it is very confusing to me and I would suspect that is in part because you're getting information second hand and then passing it here. It doesn't help either than DWP staff can give poor advice or word things badly. So to be honest we're in blind mode here and I'm wondering if he is soon to get the CAB help?

If they've received his completed appeal form then things are okay. The 'valid case for appeal' might be a red herring here...a misunderstanding of some sort... maybe they will speak to him to see if he wants to explain in more detail why he disagrees with decision. What is important is that intent to appeal is given in time and that he gets a statements of reasons for the decision and copy of all evidence they used for it. With CAB help or with your help it's then a case of trying to interject new evidence (if possible) into the process.. hopefully before an automatic reconsideration is done by the DWP so it can be considered then. A fuller explanation of the grounds of appeal (than on the form submitted)... i.e. details of why you think decision is wrong and what it should be, can be constructed by CAB or otherwise for use by DWP if sent in time or thereafter the tribunals service in appeal.

Hopefully his '3 hour callback' will clarify something here... all he probably needs to know is that they've received his appeal form and he needs to make sure he's requested the documents he needs (their evidence, statement of reasons for decision) if he hasn't already got them.

He would normally be able to get assessment rate ESA while awaiting appeal if under the cover of sicknotes sent to them (Benefits delivery centre)

DanielClark

my friend had his appeal about a month ago and it was decided that the original decision was correct. naturally he is upset, and has submitted another claim on the grounds that his condition has worsened.

since the decision, he has had 2 further payments for ESA at the assessment rate paid into his bank account.

as I understand it, he called the people overseeing his claim about it, and he was told that the first of the 2 payments was paid because the DWP didn't get word of the court's decision until the day after the payment was cleared and by the time they were in posession of the facts, it was too late.

the second payment was paid into his account about 3 weeks after the DWP learned of the decision. after calling them to find out if the payment was made in error, he was told that it was indeed, but because the error was at their end, he would not be required to pay it back.

is this normal procedure for being paid in error? if the error is made by the DWP, do they write it off?

rogerblack

DanielClark wrote: »

is this normal procedure for being paid in error? if the error is made by the DWP, do they write it off?

In general, yes, this is the policy.
In this case, it seems to be more generous than usual, as the payment was not made through their error, but - if they say they're not recovering - great!

fatblackandwhite

Can I just add that the JC+ have taken to calling people wanting to appeal ESA decisions to try and put them off the appeal. (due to the shear number). We always advise not to put your phone number on the GL24 - but if you have, and they do phone you and start asking questions - we would suggest saying the CAB (or someone else) is dealing with your appeal and the JC+ should phone them with any questions. (They wont be able to without signed consent). Anyone appealing an ESA decision should also ensure they send 'fit notes' (sick notes) from their GP otherwise payment will cease. Payment should be £67.50 per week whilst appeal being considered. Also, the first fit note should be for no more than 3 months.

DanielClark

rogerblack wrote: »

In general, yes, this is the policy.
In this case, it seems to be more generous than usual, as the payment was not made through their error, but - if they say they're not recovering - great!

I kind of got the feeling from talking to him that that was what had happened. they had paid it in error. it was seemingly processed and paid after they were notified of his appeal failure.

either way, I'm not going to give him any morality lecture, he's told me he is struggling for money right now, and I do feel he is one of the many genuine ones that have been shafted by the system, so...

as a taxpayer though, I find myself asking the question, how frequent errors like this are? I can't believe it's an isolated incident, nor can I believe that it's just the geniune ones that have been in reciept of this kind of good luck.

even if it's just 10 people that have been "fortunate" enough to have experienced an error like this, that's the best part of 1500 quid of taxpayers money that has been handed out by mistake.

I think if the DWP want to make some savings in benefit expenditure, they should look at their own shortfallings rather than go after the genuinely ill in the first place.

rogerblack

DanielClark wrote: »

even if it's just 10 people that have been "fortunate" enough to have experienced an error like this, that's the best part of 1500 quid of taxpayers money that has been handed out by mistake.

Oh - this is the teeniest tiniest amount of money!

There are over 50000 cases waiting on their tribunal appeal.
This totals over 150 million pounds a year.
Of this - 65% of people who get help with their appeal will succeed.

Even taking the somewhat doubtful statistic that 35% of people who go to tribunal are not entitled, and that this could have been found out at an earlier stage - a rational system would spend more than half an hour per claimant trying to make better decisions, and to inform the claimant of the reason why their claim is being refused - before going to waste on average 1200 pounds or so per claimant that appeals.

Unfortunately, the managers that manage to get their decisions about benefit claimants done in 29 minutes, not 30, are not penalised if by doing so they make less accurate decisions, resulting in more expenditure elsewhere.

Nevermind the stress to claimants.

HB58

fatblackandwhite wrote: »

Can I just add that the JC+ have taken to calling people wanting to appeal ESA decisions to try and put them off the appeal. (due to the shear number). We always advise not to put your phone number on the GL24 - but if you have, and they do phone you and start asking questions - we would suggest saying the CAB (or someone else) is dealing with your appeal and the JC+ should phone them with any questions. (They wont be able to without signed consent). Anyone appealing an ESA decision should also ensure they send 'fit notes' (sick notes) from their GP otherwise payment will cease. Payment should be £67.50 per week whilst appeal being considered. Also, the first fit note should be for no more than 3 months.

As a follow-on to this, I believe it is now possible for an appeal to be withdrawn following such a phone conversation, whereas previously it could only be done in writing. So be very careful when taking one of these calls, make sure you do not say anything that could be construed as forefitting your right to appeal (unless you are 100% certain that you wish to do so)!

DanielClark

I spoke to my friend again yesterday and he was telling me that he has another "medical" coming up next week. unfortunately, I don't think I'll be able to go with him for support this time as I can't get the day off.

he says he has a consultants letter arranged at the local hospital and is trying to find out whether he can get the hospital to fax it direct to the DWP in hope that it might cut out the middle man (in this case ATOS).

can this be done, and if so, how would he go about it? also, would it actually do any good?

DanielClark

my friend picked his consultants letter up today and I had a quick look through it earlier. it looks like a well presented document, but has one thing on it that I'm not too sure about. I've mentioned it in passing to him, but I'm not sure how big a problem it might be.

it references income support instead of ESA before the main body of the letter.

would ATOS or the DWP refuse it as evidence on something like this? it states all the facts and everything, it's just that it's "RE: income support" and not "RE: ESA"