Letting Agent check out fee

Lukey__b

Hi all,

I have recently moved out of a small flat I was in for a year with no real problems. I have been asked to pay a check out fee by the Letting Agent and it turns out that the tenancy agreement mentioned in a line something like ‘tenant will pay any check out fees and fees related to damage/cleaning incurred’.

Am I obligated to pay this fee considering no specific amount was specified?

If it doesn’t matter that the amount was not specified could there be a problem with them saying ‘fees incurred’? -‘tenant will pay any check out fees and fees related to damage/cleaning incurred’ - Looking at this I would expect that I would be liable to pay for the cleaner and plasterer to come round if they needed to, but also for the fee of someone from an independent inventory company. When I moved in I payed a fee for an independent inventory to be taken, but considering this time it was just a chap from the LA just 5 minutes away, do I really owe them for spending a couple of minutes looking at my 1 room studio? I mean it’s not a fee incurred as I would describe it e.g. them needing to hire a plasterer.

I don’t hold any grudge against the LA for this and realise that this is how they make their money as a business (not that I’m exceptionally happy with anyone charging extortionate fees, but it’s a free market as they say), but it just grates a little because:
He was late to do the check out which in turn made me late to get back to work
He was only an LA from their office down the road, not someone who really incurs a fee
He was only there for a max of 10 minutes, but probably closer to 5
I wasn’t the one who wanted the inventory checked, surely the landlord is the one interested so why can’t they pay it?

I don’t really consider that value for money so I’d rather not pay it if there was a way I could avoid it.

I know it’s not really a huge deal, but it just annoys me I’m paying an extortionate amount for something I don’t want, took 5 minutes, a brain damaged monkey could do, that I didn’t have an interest in AND it made me late. Plus, if I don’t have to pay it if I’m not contractually obliged to, I don’t see why I should just give them money out of the kindness of my heart (especially as I payed £180 check in fee already).

Anyone know where I stand and if I can avoid paying this? Sorry about the long post.

Thanks everyone

Scho

Have you got your deposit back yet?

Lukey__b

No, not yet. I have had the DPS email me saying that the LA have initiated returning the deposit, I’ve logged on and the fee has been deducted from the proposed repayment.

I’m holding on whether to accept or decline at the moment depending on the answers I get here. If I’ve signed myself into paying it, I can accept that I messed up and will pay it; equally, if the LA has messed up then I’d rather not pay it.

BitterAndTwisted

Ask the agent why they are charging for the check-out when you paid for the check-in. Normally the landlord would pay the agent's charge for the check-in and the outgoing tenant for the check-out. You should not be paying for both unless you appointed the contractor to do the check-in without reference to the agent.

Scho

How much are they trying to [STRIKE]extort [/STRIKE]charge you for this quite poor service of a check-out?
But then I gather if it's £30 or something I'm guessing they're hoping you won't object to this but then it's not really fair in not stating their fees outright for this yet obliging you to pay it.

Lukey__b

I don’t think they are willing to discuss or negotiate the fee. When speaking about it before they have just said that it is in the tenancy agreement that I signed and that this is normal for everyone letting with them and that I was welcome to dispute it with the DPS – this wasn’t said in an unfriendly manner at all and I have no issue with the LA.

The only way I am going to not pay it is if I dispute it with the DPS and they find the contract unenforceable. Which is fair enough, I just don’t want to put me and the LA through a long wait for the money if the contract is actually fair and kosher.

If I hadn’t had to wait for the LA who made me late or if it was an independent contractor who did it, I probably would have just accepted it straight away.

Thanks for the replies by the way.

BitterAndTwisted

It doesn't really matter who actually did the check-out, it's quite normal for someone from the agency to do it rather than contracting an independent inventory clerk. It's in your contract and it's only fair that you should pay for it.

When you moved in you paid a fee for an independent inventory to be taken. Was this contracted and paid for by you or did the agency contract them and charge you for it? As I said it's normal for the tenant to pay for one but not both, unless you contracted the check-in inventory yourself.

Lukey__b

@Sho

It’s £60. So not too much, but I’d rather keep it.

My cynical side was telling me that they were pulling a fast one – put a tiny sentence halfway through the pages of small print saying I need to pay an undisclosed fee at the end of the tenancy, then just sending out letters trying to get £60 out of anyone they can. If only 1 person out of 10 falls for it and doesn’t dispute, then they’re still quids in. Also people will want that deposit back ASAP usually and so are almost held ransom by it and will just pay the £60 to release the deposit.

Paranoid theory I’m sure.


@BittterAndTwisted

The agency contracted them and charged me for it the day they gave me the keys and I moved in. It was all part of the ‘setting up’ fee that I paid.

If it is in the contract that I pay for both check-in and check-out then surely I am obligated to pay for both regardless of what is normal practice? Or is there some law/guideline saying that I can only be charged for one?

I only questioned the fairness of paying £60 as the fee was undisclosed and it was just the LA that came for about 5 minutes. I don’t think the LA is on £300 an hour or they lost £60 of earnings by doing the check out. Where is the line drawn? Can they send up the toilet cleaner to pop his head in the door long enough to say ‘All is ok’, leave and then charge me £200, purely because I signed a contract which says ‘tenant will pay any check out fees and fees related to damage/cleaning incurred’?

If I am tied in by contract then I agree it is only fair I pay it. If the contract doesn’t oblige me to pay it, then it is only fair I don’t.

I hope that doesn’t come across as me trying to argue with you, Bitter, I value and appreciate your reply, but I can’t get my head around the fact that someone can put a clause in saying ‘tenant will pay any fee we deem to charge them when they move out’ and that this is enforceable.


If the consensus is that the DPS will agree with the LA then I’ll just accept. Again, thanks for the replies.

Scho

Paranoia is about right I think - but then it's always the risk of renting with agents and their fees. This is the cleverest way I've seen them charging a fee though.

I think B&T is ultimately right here though I'm afraid (he normally is! )
However, can the deposit be used for LA fees B&T? I assumed the deposit was purely held on behalf on the landlord/LA for damages etc relating to their house and not their additional services? I'm probably wrong but might help.

Lukey__b

Thanks Sho.

If the contract is enforceable and perfectly legit then they are welcome to take it from my deposit. I don’t have a problem with that and I’m not trying to cheat them out of a fee they are legally entitled to. I don’t think what they’re charging is fair, but that is neither here nor there really if I am contractually obliged to pay it.

Looks like I’m going to have to pay it then. Not a big deal but I thought they were taking the p*ss asking for £60 (especially by being late and using time I could be earning money with), so I thought I’d take it back by trying to wriggle out of paying it. I wasn’t bother at all initially, but then I got a thought in my head and I can be a stubborn git sometimes.

I’ll wait until Monday to accept, just in case anyone else pops in with a loophole of some sort.

Thanks Sho and BitterandTwisted.

Lukey__b

Hi again,

After speaking with an EA friend of mine, I'm pretty sure I'm going to dispute the fee with DPS.

The DPS website says they have their own arbitors but if they can't settle it then it can go to court. If my deposit dispute goes to court what happens? Will I be paying court fees? Could I be forced to pay more than the £60 should things not go my way.

I think the DPS will side with me as I don't think deducting money for fees is what the deposit is for. If the DPS award me all of my deposit back and the LA then take me to court, would this be a small claims court? Would I be paying fees etc. I think I read somewhere that it would all be dealt with online with no additional fees.