Urgent advice required re philips bailiffs

originalkitten

Hi there
I am writing on behalf of my mother who is a disabled and chronically ill lady (we both are).

A few years ago my mother had a carer come into her home and care for her. At first, at the beginning of the century, this was paid for by the council, then out of the blue they decided they were going to start charging. Now I don't know all the ins and outs just that my mum had no idea and next minute she had a £1400 bill. Now my mother came to an arrangement and paid off £14 per month and has paid off nearly £1000 of this. She pays by cheque as she prefers this as it's easier for her to keep track of it. She struggles to pay this because of her other expenses. And her typical payment was bi-monthly and pay £28.

Anyway she sent a payment for £28 one month because she was late and it was returned because her account # wasn't on the back. Before she had a chance to return the cheque with the account # on she received a letter from Philips bailiffs.

My mum phoned them and they asked her to pay £25 p/m. She said "if I am struggling to pay £14 p/m then how on earth can I pay £25" She was told that was that and nothing else they could do.
She then asked me to help but unfortunately I got rushed into hospital with a severe asthma attack and I totally forgot given the circumstances.

Today she received another letter saying that she hasn't been in touch, and yet she has, and that they are sending someone out. She was crying down the phone to me panicking so I have come on here to try find some information.

Where does she stand with this? What are her rights? Is there any documentation that the bailiffs should have that she can ask for proof of?

Thank you in advance and speed is of the essence as my mum has a heart problem and Im worried this will cause stress on her.

Kind regards

dancingfairy

Hi - who does your mum owe money to? is it the carer that's taken her to court or do you mean the council are owed the money? If it's the council (which I guess it is?) then you need to get in touch with the council and ask them to take the debt back because
1) the debt came about through no fault of her own - ie the system changed (also check she is indeed liable for the bill - it wouldn't be the first time a mistake was made)
2) she made an arranagement to pay and 1 month was late and it was immeadietly passed to the bailiffs without warning - very harsh
3) she is ill and disabled and classed as avulnerable person.
4) dealing with the bailiffs will not do her any good and she still can't pay more than she is paying.

The council should have the power to take the debt back but you may need to speak to someone senior as they may attempt to fob her/you off. Do you have permission to speak to them on her behalf at all?
I'd phone them and follow it up with a letter in the post as well confirming what was agreed.
Best of Luck
df

dancingfairy

I'd also consider looking on National Debtline's website and maybe giving them a ring on what to do IF the bailiffs actually did turn up - I believe as long as you refuse entry and keep them outside you are o.k but double check this with National Debtline.
df

hallowitch

has your mother ever been taken to court for this debt (i suspect the answer is no) Philip's are also debt collectors and there headed letters can be very misleading as they it says bailiffs and debt collectors on it

I suspect they are acting as debt collectors in this instance therefore have no power what so ever

get in touch with the council and find out exactly where this debt came from and why and the exact amount of the debt that was passed to Philip's (if necessary you may have to subject access request the council)

dancingfairy

Depending on how quickly you are able to get sense out of the council you may want to phone and again write as a back up to Phillips stating that you are in contact with the council and have asked them to investigate and request that they put the account on hold whilst the council looks into the matter.
df

RAS

Whatever happens until your mother can clearly explain whether these are bailiffs or not, she MUST NOT let Philips into the house, or open her door to anyone she does not know.

You need to know a lot more before we can help you.

originalkitten

Thank you so much to everyone for such a rapid response. I truly appreciate it!

My mum owes money to the council. Sefton Council and it was them that organised the care packages are the ones who charge. It was back in 2003 and my mum has just told me the full details.

She was in hospital with viral menigistism (not meningitis) which was caused by her Lupus. She was put on chemo because she had lost her memory (some kind of treatment used for this in lupus patients) I vaguely remember it happening. Anyway while she was in hospital she was still getting a carer and when she came out there were bills and because of her memory loss she had no idea what they were for. Eventually she got in touch with the council and made an arrangement to pay £14 per month. As mentioned she's supposed to pay monthly but she pays bi-monthly and pays £28. She even puts a notelet card in to them that says ty for your patience and explains why her payments late! (yes she's a soft touch lol)

A few weeks ago she posted a cheque to the council but forgot to put the account number on the back of the cheque. They returned the cheque and asked her to fwd another one with the account number on. Before she got a chance to do this a letter arrived from Philips stating that if she didn't pay the amount in full they would pass the file onto their enforcement dept for further recovery procedures. Mum, without my knowledge, had phoned up and tried to make arrangement with Philips but they asked for £25 per month and my mum said "I am having difficulties paying £14 p/m so how on earth can I pay £28" and Philips wouldnt budge and they were going to proceed with bailiff action. I explained to Mum then that this was scaremongering and they can't send the bailiffs without court and I said I would look into it. Unfortunately I had a severe asthma attack and was in hospital so I totally forgot all about it until today when mum received a letter from Philips saying because she hasn't been in touch then they are going to proceed with a bailiff and to expect someone.

This is where my Mum panicked and phoned me in tears because she's just done her lounge in new furniture (she had the old stuff for over 15 years) and was scared they were going to take it all away.

Lets see if Ive got this right:


So first of all they have to take her to court to get a bailiff removal?
Because she is sick and chronically ill she is classed as a vulnerable person? (In my eyes she is very vulnerable)
Yes she is on benefits due to being unable to work due to her illnesses

I am going to try contact the council. I wont hold my breath (esp being asthmatic!) and see if I can get any sense out of them. I doubt I will go far. I remember trying to speak to them before over this and they hadnt a clue.

Do you know of any template letters I could use to send to the council as I am so out of touch with financial law I would hate to make a mistake.

And thank you SO much for everything.

RAS

As a starting point, mum needs to stop talking to the Philips. She needs to write to them. That prevents them suggesting that there are dire consequences that are legally unlikely. Will provide a letter shortl;y.

The big problems we have is that neither you nor your mother seem to know whether the council or Philips have taken any legal action previously? Nor do either of you seem to know whether philips are acting as debt collectors or bailiffs or whether Philips have bought the debt or just are acting for the Council. Until you sort that out, everything is speculation.

She needs to find that out.

Please note that even if they go to court and get permission to send in the bailiffs, they can only enter her house if she invites them in or leaves a door or window open through which they can make peaceful entry. So she needs to remember to lock the doors and windows.

However, buying a new set of furniture when she has not sorted out clearing up this debt was not clever.

She needs proper advice from Age UK about the debt and they may be able to send a letter regarding vulnerability. Do NOT deal with this on the phone unless you get the full name of the person you are speaking to and follow up with a letter immediately stating what was discussed and what has been agreed.

She also needs to get some proper advice (Age UK would be a good start), as to whether she should actually be paying this charge in the first place.

hallowitch

My mum owes money to the council. Sefton Council and it was them that organised the care packages are the ones who charge. It was back in 2003 and my mum has just told me the full details.

She was in hospital with viral menigistism (not meningitis) which was caused by her Lupus. She was put on chemo because she had lost her memory (some kind of treatment used for this in lupus patients) I vaguely remember it happening. Anyway while she was in hospital she was still getting a carer and when she came out there were bills and because of her memory loss she had no idea what they were for. Eventually she got in touch with the council and made an arrangement to pay £14 per month. As mentioned she's supposed to pay monthly but she pays bi-monthly and pays £28. She even puts a notelet card in to them that says ty for your patience and explains why her payments late! (yes she's a soft touch lol)

A few weeks ago she posted a cheque to the council but forgot to put the account number on the back of the cheque. They . Mum, without my knowledge, had phoned up and tried to make arrangement with Philips but they asked for £25 per month and my mum said "I am having difficulties paying £14 p/m so how on earth can I pay £28" and Philips wouldnt budge and they were going to proceed with bailiff action. I explained to Mum then that this was scaremongering and they can't send the bailiffs without court and I said I would look into it. Unfortunately I had a severe asthma attack and was in hospital so I totally forgot all about it until today when mum received a letter from Philips saying because she hasn't been in touch then they are going to proceed with a bailiff and to expect someone.

This is where my Mum panicked and phoned me in tears because she's just done her lounge in new furniture (she had the old stuff for over 15 years) and was scared they were going to take it all away.

Lets see if Ive got this right:


So first of all they have to take her to court to get a bailiff removal?
Because she is sick and chronically ill she is classed as a vulnerable person? (In my eyes she is very vulnerable)
Yes she is on benefits due to being unable to work due to her illnesses

I am going to try contact the council. I wont hold my breath (esp being asthmatic!) and see if I can get any sense out of them. I doubt I will go far. I remember trying to speak to them before over this and they hadnt a clue.

Do you know of any template letters I could use to send to the council as I am so out of touch with financial law I would hate to make a mistake.


I am absolutely disgusted that a local authority has sent this debt to outside debt collectors/bailiffs

I would send an email to CEO Margaret carney [EMAIL="bsu.chex@sefton.gov.uk"]bsu.chex@sefton.gov.uk[/EMAIL] (followed up by recorded delivery letter) outlining the fact that Sefton council are very aware of your mothers vulnerability ask if its common practise for suffock council to pass debts of the very vulnerable to outside debt collectors /bailiffs as you believe all local authority's have a duty of care to vulnerable debtors

outline the fact that She even puts a notelet card in to them that says ty for your patience and explains why her payments late


put a short explantion of her medical condition inform her that a few weeks ago she forgot to put the account number on the back of the cheque the council returned the cheque and asked her to fwd another one with the account number on.

Before she got a chance to do this a letter arrived from Philip's stating that if she didn't pay the amount in full they would pass the file onto their enforcement dept for further recovery procedures

she is now getting letters with the threat of removal of goods from Philip's

ask her to confirm that Sefton council have a warrant for the recovery for this debt by distress

tell her your mother has little knowledge of this debt but steps have now been taken to rectify this


ask her to return the debt to local authority control and for payment to continue until you get all information from Sefton council to allow you to audit this debt as she has been paying it for xx years

churchrat

I would also consider getting in touch with a local paper if you do not get any help from the council. Also your local councillor might be helpful. Have you been in touch with the charities that deal with lupus?

good luck with all of this, dont forget to post on the benefits board, they may have some knowledge that can help about the care package.

churchrat

originalkitten

Ty so much for all your help. I will reply properly later when I'm on the computer.

Just a couple of points. We know that Sefton council did
Not take legal action as it was literally only weeks ago she sent that payment. She's had none of the usual reminders either. Also the first letter is worded as of it's a DC. THe second was worded as if a bailiff but I said it was only worded that way cause it's scaremongering. I said they want you to panic pay.

And re her furniture we bought it her and I'm not talking hundreds of pounds. It's Argos specials. I watch her spending for her as I know she can overspend (can't we all).

Anyway will reply later when on comp. Ty for your help. I truly thank you from the bottom of my heart.