Entitlement to compassionate leave

ohreally

LadyMissA wrote: »

no one has died though, have they?

Given the inevitability of death, the conversation will happen at some point.

3v3

misssarahleigh wrote: »

Good job i don't work their then.

My god, the results of telling me I was not allowed to attend my Gnradma's funeral wouldn't be worth thinking about!!!

I would go and let them disiplin/fire me for it tbh. I don't think I could live with the guilt of not saying goodbye and I certainly wouldn't be very productive at work!

Thanks for the help

While I agree with your sentiment, I question your logic. Yes, of course you would *want* to attend a g/parents funeral, but, in this economic climate, to do so at the cost of your employment ... *shudders* ... bet your g/parent wouldn't agree with you on that one!

Saying "goodbye" is something you do while the person is alive. You do it in person/via letter/telephone/email if that is an option.

Funerals, however, are a form of "respect" (the deceased does not know if you are there or not); although, it can be cathartic for the bereaved.

Why wait to mention it "unless" something happens? Reading your posts its more a case of "until" not "unless". If "he's bothered", he should be making time/plans now to say his "goodbyes/I love you's". Planned time off an employer can deal with.

If he and his father are so important to the running of the business, that in itself gives them a certain amount of leaway. (think time to interview/replace).

I do hope your oh's G/ma is comfortable and not in distress/pain with whatever it is that ails her. Wishing his father a safe journey tonight!

stephyt23

As others have stated there is no law about compassionate leave. I've heard people be refused to go to funerals before, again because they are not immediate family. This even included one person I worked with whose grandparents had brought her up and she wasn't allowed to go. needless to say she just phoned in sick on the day as there was no way she was missing it

paddedjohn

claire16c wrote: »

If I worked for someone as horrible as that, and knew they were going to say no, even i said Id use holiday or unpaid leave,I guess the only option left would be Id call in sick.

Whem my grandad died, I had 4 days off work and another 2 the following week to go to the funeral and my boss didn't mind. I guess she knew when I did come back to work, Id at least be productive, and I was a hard worker and me being off, was no different than if Id gone on holiday, I just caught up with stuff when I got back.

Family is more important than bosses.

Agreed, but family dont pay your wages!

SarEl

claire16c wrote: »

If I worked for someone as horrible as that, and knew they were going to say no, even i said Id use holiday or unpaid leave,I guess the only option left would be Id call in sick.

Whem my grandad died, I had 4 days off work and another 2 the following week to go to the funeral and my boss didn't mind. I guess she knew when I did come back to work, Id at least be productive, and I was a hard worker and me being off, was no different than if Id gone on holiday, I just caught up with stuff when I got back.

Family is more important than bosses.

A nice sentiment which I cannot disagree with - but the advice is very dangerous. Do not call in sick. Not unless you intend to get sacked, and if that is your intention then you may as well just state that you are taking two days unpaid leave whether they agree or not and get sacked for the truth. If he says that he is sick when it is patently obvious that he is not and has gone to a funeral that his father will also be off work for (so they would know when it was) then the element of "reasonable belief" that he is lying goes off the score card. So he is sacked for lying about sick leave.

If I had to explain one or the other to another employer I know which version I would rather go with. A prospectyive employer may well be very sympathetic about being sacked for unauthorised leave because your employer would not let you go to a funerla of a relative - they are less likely to be so sympathetic about your lying about being sick when you aren't. Because they would then be left wondering whether you would pull a sickie every time you wanted to.

claire16c

SarEl wrote: »

A nice sentiment which I cannot disagree with - but the advice is very dangerous. Do not call in sick. Not unless you intend to get sacked, and if that is your intention then you may as well just state that you are taking two days unpaid leave whether they agree or not and get sacked for the truth. If he says that he is sick when it is patently obvious that he is not and has gone to a funeral that his father will also be off work for (so they would know when it was) then the element of "reasonable belief" that he is lying goes off the score card. So he is sacked for lying about sick leave.

If I had to explain one or the other to another employer I know which version I would rather go with. A prospectyive employer may well be very sympathetic about being sacked for unauthorised leave because your employer would not let you go to a funerla of a relative - they are less likely to be so sympathetic about your lying about being sick when you aren't. Because they would then be left wondering whether you would pull a sickie every time you wanted to.

I agree, but I did mean if you had already gone with the unpaid leave thing and been refused, as it sounds as though his boss is already going to say no to. So I guess he could do that and then just not turn up.

Or is there such a thing as being 'sick' with grief?? What qualifies as sick?

3v3

claire16c wrote: »

...

Or is there such a thing as being 'sick' with grief?? What qualifies as sick?

Depression.

SarEl

I don't think it matters what "qualifies" as sick. What matters is whether the employer believes it. I am simply going with "may as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb" - if you are going to risk your job then you may as well risk it over the truth rather than a lie. Lying puts you in the wrong, legally; telling the truth puts the employer in the wrong, morally if not legally. After all - if you are genuinely that sick that you cannot attend work, you are not well enough to travel across the country to a funeral either. It isn't that I think the employer is being at all great about this - I just see no reason for the OP's OH to put themselves in the wrong. And it is vaguely possible that the employer might back down if presented with "I am going to the funeral of my beloved grandmother and you can take it or leave it", but few employers would back down in the face of a lie. Personally, as an employer, I would rather close the damned office than refuse permission for people to go to a funeral, but that's just me. And to be fair, if the roles are critical and nobody else can do the job(s) then, being utterly neutral, other people's work and future employment could be on the line if production stops for a few days. I have every sympathy with the position of the OP and I would certainly go come hell or high water - but I would also have to balance the risk I was taking and be prepared for the fallout - we do not know for a fact that the employer does not have good reasons to refuse, or what is riding on their position.

Tixy

claire16c wrote: »

Or is there such a thing as being 'sick' with grief?? What qualifies as sick?

I have seen doctors' notes with the illness/condition box simply filled in with 'bereavement'. The people were simply not fit to work due to their bereavement. Admittedly both the cases I can recall were immediate family.

In the OPs situation I would write to the employer requesting the day off (AL) and explaining the situation.

3v3

<devils advocate> Just to throw into the debate here: while I do empathise with the 1 (or 2) employee(s) who may be on the cusp of bereavement and wish to attend a funeral; doesn't the "big" picture feature at all? The UK is in astronomical debt; businesses, particularly the SME's, are struggling to keep a stranglehold on their business; the common man in employment is extremely fortunate to have employment (there are plenty out there who will fill their place) and there is no guarantee of future employment opportunities on the horizon ...

... heads up, folks: if you have an ailing relative (and I'm truly not unsympathetic here); the time to say your "Adieu" isn't at the funeral, its now! Jobs are becoming scarce; the economy is ailing and unless you can afford to emigrate to better climes, the cold hard truth is, you are stuck with it!

If you rely on the benefits route to soak up your misfortunes in life - well, the economy is so stretched, that really is going to be hard to draw on!

We've had the luxury of "extended" compassionate leave during the times we were rosey; being excluded from that luxury really is only about 50 yrs (at most!) history.

Abuse the "sickness" route at your own risk: jobs are scarce - never take them as a right; you may find that your boss (whose livelihood depends on his business) is prepared to hire someone else in you stead

Do you honestly think your G/parent (who came from a generation where the breadline/poverty was just a whisker away!) would commend the sacrifice of an honest days pay? My belief is, they would not. If they are sitll around to ask; ask them! If they say otherwise, I'll eat my hat!