Help with 1 year old english springer

aliasojo

Try sitting his collar higher up his neck just to see if that helps. Sounds daft but just try it.

The main part of a dog's neck has quite strong muscles, these, along with his chest and shoulder muscles are what gives him the strength to pull. When the collar is round the base of the neck, the dog can use all his strength to pull.

If the collar is sited higher (imagine above the adam's apple area if you like, just under his chin) the dog doesn't have the same strength here and cannot pull as much. I know from personal experience this works BUT the collar does slip down fairly quickly and frequently.

Caeser Milan advocates the same reasoning and he has introduced a 'double' collar which has two straps, one that sits in the normal area and one that sits higher up with a band joining the two.

If you google it you can see it but I'm not sure if you can buy it here or not. Maybe something else to consider along with the already good training advice offered.

ali-t

Lifeisbutadream wrote: »

Another problem that I have had before with the classes is when I took him before (to both the personal trainer and the class) - he was perfect whilst we were there and then seemed to forget when we were on our walks!

And again here lies the issue. You dog appears to compartmentalise his training rather than viewing lessons learned as being context transferable.

If he behaves in the church hall/park/wherever the training class is held but not outwith he is associating training only with that venue. This needs consistency to get this in place across the board.

This is the same as pooing in the garden and going into room when you are not there. Your dog seems to think the rules only apply in the place he was taught them.

If the lead walking is such a big issue is it feasible to walk him with the lead trailing behind him so you could stand on it if need be but you don't have hold of it all the time. You could be getting him used to commands like heel, sit and stay while he is walking off the lead and once he is solid with those commands you can move onto when you are holding the lead.

I am not entirely comfortable with the above suggestion as it is so easy and quick for a dog to go into the road after a child or cat but if things are as bad as you say and he is as good as you say off the lead, it may be worth a shot.

liam8282

Just one thing I have noticed that might help...

How long is your dog lead?

It might help if you get a short lead so that the dog is by your side when you are walking, and not in front of you pulling you along.

Dogs learn by repetition and consistency, so even if it is difficult now, if you can persevere it will get better.

DogsBody

Lifeisbutadream wrote: »

Another problem that I have had before with the classes is when I took him before (to both the personal trainer and the class) - he was perfect whilst we were there and then seemed to forget when we were on our walks!

hehehe, naturally. Being out on a walk is far more exciting - 'high distraction', if you like. The thing with dogs is that they don't generalise well - the fact that he will walk on the lead in a class environment doesn't generalise automatically to other environments - you have to help him there by increasing distractions gradually. If he can do 'some action' perfectly in the front room, it's unlikely he will have any idea what you want if you suddenly ask him to do that action out on a walk. You think, 'but he KNOWS this, he does it perfectly in the house', he thinks 'that sound doesn't make sense unless we are in the house'.

Here's what I am doing with my new loon, who pulls like a train on a flat collar (she has been rewarded by her previous owner for doing this, she is strong and I expect the poor owner was just dragged to wherever she wanted to go, so dog learns, pulling works).

I have her on a harness (something different to 'before'), I started in the garden after a mad 10 minutes of looning around (would start in house but house too small). I slip the handle of the lead onto a (strong) belt (hands free, less chance of injury from lunging etc), clip onto harness and make myself as interesting as possible (She will take food or a game of tuggy or a squeaky toy, so i'm lucky there). Don't ask for much, couple of steps, then sit, let off to play. Repeat many times. When I try for more steps, there comes a point where the lead goes tight. I stop, toys in pockets, totally ignore dog until she takes the pressure off. The first time this happened, i was stood there for 23 minutes, I kid you not - she is not the brightest light on the Xmas tree, I can tell ya;)

Having said that, it didn't take her too long after that to learn that I only 'reanimate' if she comes back within lead range. I started in the 'boring' bit of the garden (lawn), then progressed to the 'wild' bit, then to the field where rabbits have been, now starting on the pavement where cars going past. She is not walking by my side (6 foot lead), but she has now (2.5 months later) 'got' that wherever we are, if the lead goes tight, everything stops, and she is careful to slow down if she feels pressure.

Some distractions are too much - if she sees a rabbit or deer, if there is another dog or interesting looking people, she totally can't concentrate. If I find myself walking in those conditions, I've got it wrong for this training session, so I change the lead to her collar or go back home. The instant she will pay me some attention under those circumstances, I have the perfect reward already to hand (I'll let her off to see 'whatever', assuming the people/dogs etc are OK with that). She is hunty too, so if we have a short length (getting longer now) of good walking, I let her off for a short sniff about.

OK the essay was to show how long it's taking me, how patient I'm having to be, how I try not to screw up my training if I pick the wrong 'environment' by accident, how I can use 'what the dog wants to do' as a reward.

Use something different to walk in. If you've used a flat collar and a headcollar, try a harness. Not because it makes it easier, but so the dog knows that 'I haven't had a go of this before, we are learning something new'. If you don't have time/patience/bothered-ness to train on 'this' walk, don't use the new equipment, save it only for occasions when you DO have time. Be prepared for it to take time, and be so frustrating that you want to tear all your hair out and beat the dog to death (I go home when I feel myself approaching that stage ). Do cancel the walk attempt rather than let the dog get away with pulling even once - if it works for him once, he'll keep trying, just in case you'll let him away with it again!

If you play 'hide and seek', is he keen to come and find you? If so, the 'about turn' method mentioned earlier is a good one - I did this with my last GR, and sometimes I would find myself spinning in one spot for 5 mins as she did exactly what your boy does. It does work though, if you can be patient/consistant enough. If I couldn't get away from the front door without a tight lead, then I didn't - when the patience runs out, just go back in.

If he really is leaning on you all the time and using 'pulling on you' to balance himself, have a google of the mekuti balance harness. You use it with two attachment points and it's difficult to explain how it works (easy to demonstrate though) but the theory is that the dog has to be taught that he can't rely on 'leaning on you' to hold himself upright. I've never had to resort to anything like that but know people who swear by it.

Sorry for length, hope some of it might be useful

Youdontseeme

Lifeisbutadream wrote: »

I tried this and I am not joking, this is where I think my dog has some sort of brain deficiency - he just pulls when going the other way! so I walk along, being pulled, then I turn back and he pulls me the other way!! it doesnt matter which way I walk, its like he just needs to pull!!! if I let go of the lead he stops...

I totally know he is a wonderful dog - this thread has given me a real insight into how their little minds work as well !

What I might do, is train myself up so that I am faster than him - then pull him along!

Then how about just stopping when he pulls? I've seen Victoria do this too, stand still wait until he stops pulling, giving you that "Stooopid women come oooonnnn!!!!" look and when he's calm off you go. Repeat as necessary.

Again, there is a looking like a right t*** factor but I guess thems just the joys of dog owning.

PS: a brain deficiency??? Springers aren't daft, they are, I believe, what would be classed as eccentric in humans, very clever, no common sense and a bit odd!

DogsBody

Youdontseeme wrote: »

Again, there is a looking like a right t*** factor but I guess thems just the joys of dog owning.

Hehehe, ain't that the truth! :rotfl:

Gingham_R

ali-t wrote: »

And again here lies the issue. You dog appears to compartmentalise his training

LOL I think you're right. I was wondering if the dog had some sort of long term memory problem!

kjmtidea

I have a springer spaniel who is 14 months old. He also pulled like a husky when we got him 6 months ago. We tried so many different head collars like the halti etc but he still pulled, we also did so much training. He would walk perfectly at night but still ripped my arm off during the day, it was so painful, the lead cut my hand and pulled muscles in my arm.

Then we got the magic harness! It is amazing and I absolutely love it, I can now walk him on lead for hours every day and he doesn't pull at all. It is called Loftus, google it, you can phone and speak to them, they are very helpful. I do not have any links with this company at all, my friend who has a collie let me try her harness and it worked wonders so I bought one. Another school mum has also just bought her springer one and can't believe the difference.

Also you say that he gets 2 hours of walks a day, personally I don't think that is enough. Mine gets 10 miles on lead a day and at least 2 hours off lead, he will quite happily spend the whole day out walking in the forest though! Mine also isn't interested in food plus he has a very sensitive stomach so training with food just isn't an option. Training with attention is though, he is more than happy to do as he is told if he is rewarded with strokes and cuddles!

Lifeisbutadream

kjmtidea wrote: »

I have a springer spaniel who is 14 months old. He also pulled like a husky when we got him 6 months ago. We tried so many different head collars like the halti etc but he still pulled, we also did so much training. He would walk perfectly at night but still ripped my arm off during the day, it was so painful, the lead cut my hand and pulled muscles in my arm.

Then we got the magic harness! It is amazing and I absolutely love it, I can now walk him on lead for hours every day and he doesn't pull at all. It is called Loftus, google it, you can phone and speak to them, they are very helpful. I do not have any links with this company at all, my friend who has a collie let me try her harness and it worked wonders so I bought one. Another school mum has also just bought her springer one and can't believe the difference.

Also you say that he gets 2 hours of walks a day, personally I don't think that is enough. Mine gets 10 miles on lead a day and at least 2 hours off lead, he will quite happily spend the whole day out walking in the forest though! Mine also isn't interested in food plus he has a very sensitive stomach so training with food just isn't an option. Training with attention is though, he is more than happy to do as he is told if he is rewarded with strokes and cuddles!

Bloomin heck - you cant get much work done if you do a 10 miles walk plus 2 hours off lead!!

kjmtidea

Lifeisbutadream wrote: »

Bloomin heck - you cant get much work done if you do a 10 miles walk plus 2 hours off lead!!

The 10 miles on lead is the school and playschool run! 2 hours off lead is at the heath so the kids can run riot too. It's stuff we would be doing anyway, we just involve the dog now too .