Muzzle Recommendations?

jumpedtheshark

We've decided to get a muzzle for one of our dogs as a precautionary measure.

In case it's helpful, here's the background on her: She was always better at making friends off-leash than on-leash. We've wasted money on useless (genuinely!) trainers and classes - classes are no good because she's afraid of other dogs, so complies without learning to be comfortable; we haven't found a trainer that's helped. With a mixture of time off-leash and on-leash, she was basically OK - loved some dogs even on-leash (her 'boyfriends'), hated a couple, and disliked most. She's a rescue dog, and we got her when she was 7 months old (had been at the rescue centre since she was 4 weeks old). She's now 5-and-a-half. She's a large mixed breed (lab, shepherd, dane, something like that!), and has various medical issues - Addison's disease, hypothyroid, and heart problems. She has probably become more grumpy with other dogs as the issues have progressed - perhaps she's more anxious, feeling more vulnerable when she's out and about even though she loves her family (and the other dog she lives with)? Anyway, she had knee surgery a couple of months ago, and has been slowly recovering. This means she can't walk as far as an off-leash area, so she's on-leash only now, which we think might be causing her to regress even further in terms of socialisation with dogs and the outside world in general.

Anyway, recently she seems to have started being concerned about children running around, making noise, sudden movements, that kind of thing. She's never nipped, but we're concerned that, whilst we can control her, we can't control other people's kids. We also thought that a muzzle might give a 'heads up' to less responsible parents to keep an eye on their screaming, running children.

So.... can anyone recommend a brand that is comfortable, works well, and won't rub? Her medical problems mean she has thinner fur than normal that also doesn't readily regrow, so it rubs easily, so we're looking for something that won't blister or leave a bald patch across her nose.

Fire_Fox

Have any of the trainers been qualified (hons degree +) animal behaviourists found by a referral from your veterinarian?

bagginslover

My Greyhound-cross wore a plastic greyhound muzzle when we first got him. Its very light weight, has soft leather straps and padding over the nose. They are very cheap to buy (got mine from the rescue we bought him from www.grwe.co.uk) only about £6 I think, and come in a range of colours Greys have very thin skin and fine fur, so these are made with this in mind. If her head is wider though, a lurcher muzzle might be better (also avaliable on the same site), or even a baskerville brand muzzle-same type, plastic and leather, but tailored to other breeds and shapes.

jumpedtheshark

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Have any of the trainers been qualified (hons degree +) animal behaviourists found by a referral from your veterinarian?

Great question.

Our very first Canadian trainer was, and she was the worst by far. The first trainer over here was, and was the member of a professional body of some kind (I forget which, but it looked legit when we checked it out online); she took our money for a visit (stupidly paid by cash), said she'd send a written report with more detailed advice than the advice she gave us in the consultation, and then sent nothing. We followed up with phone calls, and she claimed she'd been in hospital and would do it, but we never got anything. No further help either.

So then we tried classes. I'm not sure if the instructor for the classes was qualified. She had been recommended by the owner of one of the two dogs our dog hates, but we found our dog was too anxious in the class to act out, and when we saw the instructor from the class one-on-one she didn't appear to really know much about behaviour beyond the rote learning for the class content.

We did try to book yet another trainer, but she cancelled the visit (on the day she was meant to come), saying that it was a long drive, and she had decided against it! We were very upset as she had also come recommended, though I don't actually know what qualifications she had.

Our vets 'don't recommend' trainers or physiotherapists (for the recovery from the surgery) - they're a cash-grabbing chain, and don't do all kinds of caring things (like recommend trainers) for liability reasons. We hoped to change vets a couple of months ago as we were planning on buying a car, but circumstances have meant that we haven't been able to get together the cash, so the less-than-perfect vets within walking distance remains our vets.

Now we're just thinking that because we love our dog we should guard against the worst case scenario as she seems to be getting grumpier. With her health problems, she's probably only got 2 years max left, so we thought we should try to manage her this way, rather than persist with trainers that don't seem to help.

Darlyd

I have to muzzle my staffy b itch as she can be quite aggressive to other dogs, We only muzzle her whilst at the vets OR if we go to a big park and let her off, other wise on normal walk (on lead) she does not need it. We use a material one that allows her to open her mouth but not to wide. I bought it from the vets.

Sorry can't help you on training as we are having similar problems..

moomin5

You'll have to introduce the muzzle gradually so that she accepts wearing it, although can tell you that even my greyhounds that are used to them do try to rub them off or bash you with them if not distracted with walking/running. Muzzles certainly seem to make people to keep their distance (& comment), but it could also make her feel more vulnerable around other dogs.

I presume she has regular reviews on her medication by the vet to rule that out as a cause for the behaviour getting worse.

You want a basket type that allows them to pant, drink etc normally and avoid the fabric ones which are only really for brief use such as at the vets.
http://www.companyofanimals.co.uk/products/muzzles-travel-and-visibility/baskerville-ultra-muzzle - this type has neoprene padding.

Fire_Fox

Referral to an animal behaviourist and recommendation of a trainer are two completely different things. Have you checked your pet insurance does not cover this? Can't you get a taxi or pay a friend or colleague (slap up homecooked meal) to take you to a better vet practice? Why haven't you written to the first trainer or opened a small claims case (cheap, no legal advice req'd)?

I would not muzzle a dog with heart problems - this can cause emotional stress and prevent effective panting, both of which can strain the heart. Agree with Moomin5 as regards thorough medication reviews.

jumpedtheshark

Her medication may/may not be contributing, but likely not. We get her blood tested every 6 weeks or so and adjust her Addison's medication if needed (I calculate the adjustments, and the vets just go along with it as they're happy with the 'normal range' but all Addison's dogs have a more precise sweet spot than that, which varies for every dog). The hypothyroid issue may be a side effect of the Addison's medication, or it may have occurred at the same time. It's harder to know where within the normal range she should be and, with the dosage she's on, she's now within the normal range, even though she does have fur thickness and regrowth problems (she's got a completely bald patch on her back from where she was shaved back in mid-March for the knee op, though fur has regrown quite a bit on her leg). I read that hypothyroidism can be related to aggression, but beyond getting her into the normal range, it's hard to know what else to do.

We are planning on permanently moving vets for her and our other dog - who's older, but very healthy, luckily! - so have been holding off the kind of 'one off' appointment you suggest, Fire Fox, until we can drive her there every few weeks. The plan would be to get them to take a look at her medical conditions, and then see if they were able to offer any input on her behavioural issues. This should be later in the summer, but we wanted to take the muzzle precaution now, just in case.

My husband worked with the awful trainer (who sent nothing, and got paid in cash), and got upset when I talked about legal action - he felt he'd been trying to help our dog by booking her, and that I was indirectly blaming him for not getting any help with the dog. (He - husband, not female dog! - suffers from depression and anxiety, so doesn't always react as rationally as you'd like in that kind of situation). That's not true, of course, but the dynamics of the situation made it easier just to drop it and forget about the money.

We don't have insurance for her, but are genuinely willing to pay for anything that might actually help. So, if the new vets recommended / referred us to a behaviourist, that would probably be our next step.

elsien

I tried a baskerville (basket type) muzzle for mutt - she kept rubbing it on the floor and got a very sore hooter so I ended up getting some cotton material and padding, and sewing it on the bit that was rubbing on her nose, which helped a bit.
You might need to try different ones (pets at home seem ok with you trying different versions to see how they fit), and make sure she can pant and drink. However one of the reasons I gave up on the muzzle (apart from I was unable to get one to fit mutt's stupid shaped head) was because it made her much more scared around other dogs as she knew she couldn't defend herself, so her behaviour got worse.
Mutt is the jump and nip type at kids, so I managed it by never having her off lead and using a halti so if she does start to jump I can pull her head round before she makes contact. I do have to be very aware of kids running around, but putting her to heel or making her sit when there's kids approaching and keeping my body between her and them has made sure of no unfortunate incidents. I also work on the basis that if any offlead dogs approach her and get bitten (I always ask owners to call their dogs away if they do come near) that's their problem not mine. Sounds harsh, but if owners don't have the control to call their dogs back, they shouldn't be off the lead in the first place.

Mind you, most people are scared of mutt anyway because of her breed, so I tend to find parents try to keep kids clear, which helps.
Edit - just a thought, but is her hearing ok? Only mutt has gone deaf, so if she doesn't hear anything coming up behind her she reacts badly if they suddenly appear/make a noise and startle her. Might be worth checking out.

jumpedtheshark

Elsien, that's a great point about her hearing.

She tends to get clogged (waxy, stinky) ears, and so we have to clean them quite regularly with a solution from the vets. It's related to her Addison's disease. I haven't noticed any hearing difficulties around the house, but it may be quite different for her when she's on the street with lots of background noise. I'll talk it over with DH, and get it checked out.