Solar Panel Guide Discussion

alterego_2

grumpyoldsteve wrote: »

Power stations also don't last much beyond 25 years, and I guess they are quite energy intensive to make as well, and also continue to spew carbon dioxide ...

Why do you think that CO2 is so dangerous? Are you confusing it with CO (many people do)? Without rushing off to Google, do you know how much CO2 there is in the atmosphere and what its chief function is? (Clue - much less of it, and we'd all be dead.)

Sorry if this is slightly OT, but the whole 'green energy' nonsense and all its spin-off is predicated on a widely misunderstood myth, which needs nailing!

alterego_2

keith_r59 wrote: »

Nice to see that this thread is continually going round in circles debating the pros and cons of small scale solar PV. If only we could harness the wasted energy being expended repeating the same tired old arguments time and time again we would all be rich.:D

I'm a guilty party, but I didn't have time to read the preceding 800-odd posts, and I was surprised to see Martin apparently endorsing a scam that fleeces the majority (his newsletter mentioned it as an investment opportunity).

Few people that I have spoken to who know that solar PV exists are aware that users are paid both for what they use as well as what they export. Their usual reaction to the news is amazement, followed by various degrees of anger, once they learn how it's paid for.

grumpyoldsteve

alterego wrote: »

Why do you think that CO2 is so dangerous? !

I don't think I said CO2 is dangerous, (although I described it along with other pollutants which I suppose implied danger), but it is apparently one of the greenhouse gases responsible for climate change which is why our government as well as other governments of more advanced renewable energy economies than ours, have signed up to various targets for carbon reduction. So CO2 is not good if there is too much of the stuff.

keith_r59

alterego wrote: »

Few people that I have spoken to who know that solar PV exists are aware that users are paid both for what they use as well as what they export. Their usual reaction to the news is amazement, followed by various degrees of anger, once they learn how it's paid for.

Life is too short to go get angry, especially about something as insignificant as solar PV, but then I suppose that is a symptom of the selfish society that we live in today.

Never mind, I'm sure there is something that you benefit from which people with solar panels don't and I for one don't begrudge you from doing so.

Live and let live.

zeupater

alterego wrote: »

.... Few people that I have spoken to who know that solar PV exists are aware that users are paid both for what they use as well as what they export. Their usual reaction to the news is amazement, followed by various degrees of anger, once they learn how it's paid for.

Hi

If you would like to educate them some more, let them know how many times the build cost they are paying for their local hospital, or school, or pretty council offices, or bridge, or police station or .... anyway have a look at this HM Treasury document ...(http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/pfi_data_summary_march2011.pdf)... considering that the returns for capital outlay are similar to FiT, it might just put things into perspective ....

Around 2500 years ago a very wise man is recorded as saying ... "Anyone can become angry - that is easy. But to be angry at the right person, to the right degree, at the right time, for the right purpose, and in the right way - that is not easy." ... it's as much true today as it was then and it is likely to ever be so ...

HTH
Z

Cardew

zeupater wrote: »

Hi

If you would like to educate them some more, let them know how many times the build cost they are paying for their local hospital, or school, or pretty council offices, or bridge, or police station or .... anyway have a look at this HM Treasury document ...(http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/pfi_data_summary_march2011.pdf)... considering that the returns for capital outlay are similar to FiT, it might just put things into perspective ....

Around 2500 years ago a very wise man is recorded as saying ... "Anyone can become angry - that is easy. But to be angry at the right person, to the right degree, at the right time, for the right purpose, and in the right way - that is not easy." ... it's as much true today as it was then and it is likely to ever be so ...

HTH
Z

We have had this discussion many times. In the cases you quote the expenditure is funded from Taxes and the wealthy(e.g. those who can afford PV panels;)) pay taxes.

The FIT system is completely different in that it is funded by a levy that the poorest in our society(pensioners etc) have no option but to contribute - as well as those who are unable to have solar PV e.g. flat occupants, those in rented accomodation, unsuitable roofs etc.

That levy is paid to those who who can afford £10,000 plus or venture capitalists financing 'Rent a roof' companies.

orrery

It would be of help to me, as I sit here awaiting installation of my 4kWp system in about 10 days time, to appreciate the generating capacity of a 4k system in different weather conditions:

Night = none (I can guess that one!)
Dark overcast, heavy rain =
Dark overcast, dry =
Light overcast =
50% cloud, no direct sun =
Clear winter day, full sun =
Clear summer day, full sun =

Would anyone venture estimates based on real experience?

regards, Ian

jago25_98

I don't want to buy into the idea of generating DC current and then converting that to AC and feeding back into the grid. Also I'd like to fit it myself, or just have it loose on the floor charging a 12v battery.

The thing is... I don't think there's a way to just `get` a cheap solar panel is there? Or am I mistaken?

edit::
Alternatively, it might be cheaper to just buy a panel from China and fit it along with 12v lights and cigarette lighter sockets to charge your laptop or computer...

keith_r59

Cardew wrote: »

We have had this discussion many times.

I rest my case.

Cardew

keith_r59 wrote: »

I rest my case.

What case would that be? Any time you are challenged on a statement you have made, you refuse to answer.

As was explained to you very simply by zeupater, there are new people reading this website and it is the nature of forums that views do get repeated.

Meanwhile, instead of one-liners that apparently you find amusing:D, why not give an reasoned argument against the view that FITs entail the poor in our society paying towards the better off?

or why we pay huge subsidies for thousands of tiny systems dotted over the UK instead of huge solar farms in the West Country.

Incidentally you have yet to come up with the names of contributors(that apparently everyone knows) who want to indulge in Schadenfreude. With relevant posts of course. See:

= keith_r59
I find it quite sad that there are a handful of posters on here who actually want people with solar PV systems to suffer financial loss because they don't agree with it?

Oh well, it takes all sorts I suppose. Have a nice day