Solar Panel Guide Discussion

John_Pierpoint

I think we existing and potential sunshine farmers need to be aware of the underlying political debate about subsidising land owners.

If push came to shove we could nearly all be put out of business by someone with a powerful catapult and a pocket full of ball bearings.

Here is a stringent critic of subsidies for those with capital of their own.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...f-cash-to-rich

The theory of taxing real estate is covered by this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4479227

silverwhistle

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

Here is a stringent critic of subsidies for those with capital of their own.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...f-cash-to-rich

I take your point, but any capital I have has been achieved through a PAYE salary, and, I acknowledge, some inflated property capital which has a value I can't realise as it's my modest home.

Now I don't have a telly or an iphone, and when I sell this 12 year old LH drive Skoda I probably won't have a car for a bit, although I might splash out on a new push bike as the current one is even older.. But I rather resent this idea of being a target because I've made different choices. I've a lot less capital (and income) than Monbiot himself, for example, but being single with no rich parents has made me pretty aware of my spending.

Anyway, I haven't got the dam' PV yet as it's a week or so before I return to the UK.:D I look on it as diversifying my limited investments, although I suppose I could always buy a new car or kitchen (the tenant was an idiot), but even some of the accountants here would acknowledge that my breakeven point on them would be even further into the future.

As for the 3% return quoted here on cash.. I won't tell you the embarassing news of the return on my cash ISA, suffice to say I was trapped in it whilst abroad Even with reduced FITS I'll certainly do better with PV and putting the balance into premium bonds!

John_Pierpoint

Another interesting little fact:

There is a surcharge on every electricity bill the equivalent of £7 a year - it pays for the electricity that has been stolen.
33% of the stolen electricity is is used to subsidised the £60k annual income of a terraced house cannabis farmer.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0368fwh

Sirlaughalot

Ok MSE`s the 3 quotes are in which hopefully you can help me with as i go along but firstly if i can ask a general question based on the sale pitches i have been given. Two of the companies that have quoted are less than 3 years old which gave me concern about the companies ability to warrant there 10 workmanship warranty. They made alot about being members of REIGA an association that would carry out any repairs during the warranty period if the installation company went bust.

Any body know any thing about REIGA ?

The_Green_Hornet

Sirlaughalot wrote: »

Ok MSE`s the 3 quotes are in which hopefully you can help me with as i go along but firstly if i can ask a general question based on the sale pitches i have been given. Two of the companies that have quoted are less than 3 years old which gave me concern about the companies ability to warrant there 10 workmanship warranty. They made alot about being members of REIGA an association that would carry out any repairs during the warranty period if the installation company went bust.

Any body know any thing about REIGA ?

Renewable Energy Installation Guarantee Agency

Sirlaughalot

The_Green_Hornet wrote: »

Renewable Energy Installation Guarantee Agency

Thanks!

Is the Agency reputable and is the guarantee worth anything?

John_Pierpoint

I have just looked at my latest Scottish Power bill.
It incudes a little pie chart showing where the money goes:
It claims that £20 of every £100 I pay goes in to Taxation viz VAT & Green levies.

Well VAT is 5%, so green levies are 15% ?

Figures don't lie but liars sure can figure ?

Is there some sort nuclear subsidy lumped into this figure?

Martyn1981

Hiya John, could the 20% include tax on profits too?

Just checked my latest bill from EDF, for leccy it states that 8% goes to:

"Social & environmental: we're obligated to take part in government programmes that help vulnerable customers and reduce CO2 emissions."

[4% from the gas bill]

Got to admit, I thought the numbers were 10% & 4%?

Regarding nuclear, my understanding is that current nuclear subsidies and decommissioning are raised via taxation. However, this is no longer allowed under EU State Aid rules. So the proposed new nukes possibly starting with Hinkley Point C in 2020 and a second reactor on site in 2023, will be subsidised via leccy bills. [Dates are only estimates, each reactor 1.6GW]

Mart.

Sirlaughalot

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Hello SL. Sorry, didn't realise what the ceramic heater bit meant. If you were thinking about leaving something on (that is optional) then burnt fingers are very likely. get it wrong and you're importing expensive leccy. There are devices, talked about on other threads, like this one:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4152489

that can direct excess generation via proportional controls, but you'll need to do some maths to see if they'll be financially viable for you.






Quick check again using PVGIS (I strongly recommend you have a play). Stuck a random pin in Birmingham, 4kWp and azimuth -110deg. [The azimuth is your point of interest, which for us is the sun, to the south, so before it is a minus, east is -90, and after it is a plus, west is +90.] ENE is approx -110.

Then tried a selection of roof pitches. 20d gave annual generation of 2,900kWh's. 50d was 2,420. So big difference. But 30 to 40 not so bad - 30d was 2,750, 35d was 2,680 and 40d was 2,600.

Shading is important, and there are ways to reduce the effect, but you can't eliminate it. Also, not ideal to install anywhere with a 'N' in it. Ignore my WNW, it is extremely marginal, and was to maximise generation, not income. For the same 'pin' location as above, PVGIS gives 3,730 for due south at 35d pitch, so ENE is a big drop, and will affect your returns significantly.

Ok, serious danger of me flooding you with too much info now (too late perhaps!). So I'll stop. But ask anything, happy to help. Also there are probably lots of old threads that cover many of the issues - but you might need directions to particular posts, on particular threads.

Your best bet, if you're still interested, might be to arrange for a few installers to pop round and assess your situation. You'll learn loads, and get a better idea on prices.

Mart.

Hi Martyn,

All three companies have surveyed the roof and supplied quotes accordingly. On a postive note they all agree on orientation around 230 degrees(S/W) on a roof pitch of 35 degrees and there are no shading issues:rotfl:.
But that`s where the consensus ends, to get 4k two of the sales man said i would need to spread the solar panels over 2 roofs but doing this would produce a drag effect which would be counter productive. The third sales man said that this is not the case.

Who`s right?

SL

John_Pierpoint

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Hiya John, could the 20% include tax on profits too?

I don't think so:
Scottish Power paid only £102m in 2012 on profits of £1.2bn
which is 8.5%.
Perhaps they are adding in the employees PAYE income tax; and NI they both pay?

With a combination of tax and deficit financing approaching 50% of GDP, perhaps only paying 20% shows the work of clever accountants?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/apr/16/big-six-energy-suppliers-tax

It is difficult to unravel the real profitability of multinational companies, they have all had a coffee at the Starbucks cookery school.

ScottishPower Ltd. is a vertically integrated energy company with its headquarters in Glasgow, Scotland. It was once a constituent of the FTSE 100 Index but in 2006 it became a subsidiary of the Spanish utility Iberdrola.